#5 When do I need to show my cards? - further explanantion |
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Posted Sat May 21, 2005 7:32 am GMT by junkerton
i read rule five, and searched the forums, but am looking for more clarification of the following scenario. sorry if this is posted elsewhere.
three guys playing:
player 1
player 2
palyer 3
player 1 raises three times, each time players 2 and 3 call.
player 1 then checks.
player 2 goes all in.
player 3 calls.
player 1 calls.
player 2 shows his cards.
player 3 shows his cards, and has beaten player 2.
player 1 sees he has been beaten by player 3.
player 1 mucks his cards.
heres the point of contention:
does player 1 HAVE TO SHOW his cards since he has been beaten, or is
he allowed to just muck?
does anyone know what the rules say in this situation?
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Posted Sat May 21, 2005 2:50 pm GMT by Iron Butt
As I understand it you can muck anytime, as long as you understand that you are giving up any possible claim to the pot.
For instance, in your scenario, say player 2 was bluffing with a weak hand like middle pair. He was called down and would be required to show first, but he can still muck even so, he just can't try to pull his hand back into play when the next guy shows a smaller pair.
Of course in home games these things tend to get decided more by consensus or by the host.
To directly answer your question, no, player 1 does not have to show his cards.
Posted Tue May 24, 2005 2:15 pm GMT by Imajica1975
I have always been unsure about this rule too.
In regards to online play, it seems like some sites have different criteria than others for determaining who has to show or muck, but I'm sure it only seems this way.
In home games I've played, people usually show their cards a lot even if they lose, but that is only because there is no real pressure, just fun.
Posted Fri May 27, 2005 9:31 am GMT by galderon
From Robert's Rules:
| Quote: | | Any player who has been dealt in may request to see any hand that has been called, even if the opponent's hand or the winning hand has been mucked. However, this is a privilege that may be revoked if abused. If a player other than the pot winner asks to see a hand that has been folded, that hand is dead. If the winning player asks to see a losing player’s hand, both hands are live, and the best hand wins. |
Like most things, it depends on the house rules. Some games are played where everyone who calls at the showdown must show their cards.
One thing I hate is players who only show one card when it's their turn to show. But that's just me. 
Posted Fri May 27, 2005 9:55 am GMT by Muck
| galderon wrote: |
Like most things, it depends on the house rules. Some games are played where everyone who calls at the showdown must show their cards.
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Defiantly my preference. We brought this in as a house rule for our home games to remove the "who has to reveal first" deadlock we used to get in.
| galderon wrote: |
One thing I hate is players who only show one card when it's their turn to show. But that's just me. |
A friend of mine started doing this, it stuck me as a really clever way to pick up a pot while still concealing half your hand information.
Unfortunately I would always ask him to turn the other one over too :p
Posted Fri May 27, 2005 10:02 am GMT by galderon
| Muck wrote: | | Defiantly my preference. We brought this in as a house rule for our home games to remove the "who has to reveal first" deadlock we used to get in. |
I haven't found it that difficult to enforce "who shows first" on my local game, so we allow people to muck if they want.
| Muck wrote: | | galderon wrote: | | One thing I hate is players who only show one card when it's their turn to show. But that's just me. |
A friend of mine started doing this, it stuck me as a really clever way to pick up a pot while still concealing half your hand information. Unfortunately I would always ask him to turn the other one over too :p |
Yeah, no one in our regular group does this, but I notice it sometimes when we have a guest at the table or if I play with a different group. Just show both friggin cards!! You're holdin' up the game! 
Posted Fri May 27, 2005 3:58 pm GMT by Fat Tony
you can tell any asshat that tries to pull this show one card b.s. that they MUST show both cards to claim any part of the pot.
Posted Fri Jun 03, 2005 12:28 am GMT by Ben4040
This is one rule that I have been unsure of as well. We have generally played live that the last person to bet or raise MUST show their hand. The other players have the option to show their hand if they would like. Of course, if they have the winning hand they must show to take the pot. We have run into problems in the past where the situation arises that no one has bet or raised the pot and no one wants to show their cards.
Posted Fri Jun 03, 2005 3:39 am GMT by Idaho
I play it that the person who was called must show, and it is up to the callers as to whether they want to show.
Posted Tue Jun 07, 2005 7:15 am GMT by Jackal
In most casinos the player who raises or takes action first must show if the dealer has to ask one of the players to show. If you muck your cards you give up all claim to the pot, just that simple. Lot's of people would rather stuff their cards into the deadwood rather than be caught in a bluff.
Posted Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:25 am GMT by galderon
| Jackal wrote: | | In most casinos the player who raises or takes action first must show if the dealer has to ask one of the players to show. If you muck your cards you give up all claim to the pot, just that simple. Lot's of people would rather stuff their cards into the deadwood rather than be caught in a bluff. |
Yeah, I agree. I don't think there's any disagreement on whether the winner needs to show his cards. More of a disagreement on when they are shown. I use the above ruling. The last person to bet or raise in the final betting round (or the guy to the left of the dealer if there is no action the final round) is required to show or muck first. Without a ruling like this you have a bunch of guys stalling, all trying to get everyone else to show first. Then they only show one card at a time, trying to figure out a way to give up as little information as possible while trying to determine if they can win the pot. Unless you like that kind of thing, it's a big waste of time!
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