Flopped straight with suited board... |
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Posted Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:48 pm GMT by cayouche
My decision wasn't stupid, but did I have other options??
Big blind with 6-4 spades, I check. For callers/limpers altogether.
Flop is 5-3-2 all hearts. I'm first to act. I had average stack (maybe just a few chips under), I go all-in.
I get one caller, he flips 2 hearts. I'm drawing dead.
We turned the other cards, in case I get the miracle runner-runner straight flush for a tie, but no help... no other hearts either.
Like I said, I don't think my desicion was stupid. I know it was bad luck, but still, was there a way I could've avoided getting my a$$ handed to me?? At least if I would've checked/call him to see if any other hearts would fall (giving me an easy fold), but that doesn't seem right either...
Any advanced comments/suggestions ???
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Posted Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:28 pm GMT by xDiamond_CutteRx
Um... don't go all-in. For one thing, you certainly don't make a play like this when you're first to act. You have NO idea if anyone hit. Besides, you had an average stack, not a short stack. I definitely check here and find out where I'm at. Just because you flopped a straight, it doesn't mean you have a lock, as you said. Your straight is dead. You wouldn't push all-in with bottom pair when you're first to act, would you? I think that's a pretty close analogy.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 1:10 am GMT by tylanthus
You have nothing invested in the hand and terrible position....check/fold. Pick a better spot.
If you're going to play...bet 2/3 the pot, fold to a raise. But that leaves a nasty turn decision...which could leave a nasty river decision.
Check/Fold.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 3:16 am GMT by gol4pro
You have to bet this flop.
I'm really not going to be happy to see a 4th heart or a raise come, so fold if either hit.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 4:07 am GMT by AAceman
i fold since i would smell the hearts,
why?
because i can goddammit
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 5:27 am GMT by zeroswarm
I'd bet the flop and see what happens. It can be pretty nasty flopping a straight with a suited board and I think an all in bet is too risky here.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 9:42 am GMT by cayouche
I know what you guys mean... I guess that a check/fold (or a bet/fold to any raise) was the other option.
The way I thought about it was somekind of reverse pot odds. The probability of someone having a made flush was less than 1/2, since I was more than doubling my stack, I was good...
Sometimes it's good to play safer than aggressive...
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 9:52 am GMT by suitedaces84
I'd play this aggressively until the 4th heart shows up. But you did you want to accomplish by going all in? Ensure that you're straight would not get paid off?
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 10:26 am GMT by Muck
You didn’t mention how much was in the pot or how big your stack was, but I’m guessing the pot wasn’t big enough to justify this move.
Most of the time you’ll take a small pot like this, but all of those small pots added together will still be less than the one time you get called and lose your stack.
I think you fell in love with your straight, I know how you feel with me it’s picking up KK then get raised when the flop brings an A. You’ve just got accept that you might be beat and be willing to let it go.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 10:38 am GMT by cayouche
| Muck wrote: | | I think you fell in love with your straight, I know how you feel with me it’s picking up KK then get raised when the flop brings an A. You’ve just got accept that you might be beat and be willing to let it go. |
...
I folded AA before when I knew I was beat... that's not the point. There's no way I could know I was beat, I was 1st to act. I didn't have the time to get married with it...
220 in the pot, was ready to take it right there, that's all.
The more I think about it, I think I should've bet the pot maybe. Knowing the guy (who called), he always bets/raises when he has a good hand...
Like I said, I don't think my decision was stupid, but now I know I could've played this one better...
Thanks all.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 1:18 pm GMT by Phil14312
I agree bet the pot on the flop and fear the hearts. But to check/fold on the flop I think is horribly weak play. The problems start to occur when someone starts to get frisky with like 9  9  . Then if he moves in you have a hard decision to make.
Posted Fri Jun 10, 2005 5:35 pm GMT by Hurricane Ham
By pushing all in and overbetting the pot, the only hands you're going to get called by are hands that beat you, i.e. the flopped flush, or possibly some goon with the A . Bet 2/3 to the pot on the flop to see what happens, but I'd be wary of callers. Obviously let it go if another heart hits, you've gotta believe the straight is no good anymore. If the player had any sense, he'd probably just smooth call the flop and maybe even the turn though, so really, you're just screwed on this hand.
Check/fold is an awful play on the flop. Maybe check/fold to the turn or river if you feel like you're beat, but the entire hand? No way. You flopped a straight, you need to bet it out.
Posted Sat Jun 11, 2005 12:12 am GMT by cayouche
| Hurricane Ham wrote: | | By pushing all in and overbetting the pot, the only hands you're going to get called by are hands that beat you, i.e. the flopped flush, or possibly some goon with the A . |
Exactly. That's what I tried to achieve. A 220 pot was more than enough for me with that crap.
I wasn't mad or pissed... I didn't care really, 'cause I knew it was just bad luck basically. One time, the same guy bluff-reraised me on the flop, I had trips, pushed all-in, he called (?!?). Caught runner-runner flush... that would piss anyone off, but on this hand, I didn't care really, shit happens...
Edit: I should've done what my sig says... 
Posted Sat Jun 11, 2005 9:45 pm GMT by Hurricane Ham
| Quote: | Hurricane Ham wrote:
By pushing all in and overbetting the pot, the only hands you're going to get called by are hands that beat you, i.e. the flopped flush, or possibly some goon with the A . |
| Quote: | | Exactly. That's what I tried to achieve. A 220 pot was more than enough for me with that crap. |
What you tried to achieve by pushing all in was to get called by the flopped flush, a hand that leaves you drawing to runner straight flush for a split?
I assume what you meant is that by pushing all in, you were just going to take the pot down more often than not, since the likelihood of someone flopping a flush is very small. An all in bet isn't necessary to get people to fold if they don't have the flush though. By betting 2/3 of the pot, you're giving someone with a decent heart poor odds to call, so they would probably lay down, or chase and miss 2/3 of the time anyways. You also risk substantially less chips betting somewhere around the pot on the flop into a pot in which you have very little invested.
Avoid going broke in an unraised pot.
Posted Mon Jun 13, 2005 1:38 pm GMT by Loonbat
Actually, with 2/3rds of the pot bet, you're giving them decent odds to call if they're counting other cards (overcards) as outs.
IMHO, overbet the pot (300). If they call or fire back, you should then put them on the flush. A smart player will see their odds on a draw don't even come close to their ROI (return on investment), and they should fold.
-Loon
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