Posted Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:23 pm GMT by Dat_Dude
I assume everyone knows what I am referring to. I realize this is a very basic concept that about every good poker player uses. I am just curious how much you typically think is enough to gather the information necessary to judge the strength of your opponent's hand.
Let's take a NL Tourney example with 100/200 blinds.
Say you are sitting in middle position with K  K  . You raise the typical 3-4x the BB and make it 600 to go. Everyone folds but one person in early position that just calls.
Flop:
A  6  9
A pretty uneventful flop, but obviously that Ace has you thinking a bit.
Scenario 1:
Villain leads out with a modest $400-$600 bet. You obviously like your Kings and want to find out if they are any good.
Scenario 2:
Villain checks possibly to trap and/or try and steal the pot after inducing a decent bet from you.
Question: What would you guys consider a decent sized bet to find out if this guy is indeed holding one of those 3 aces? If he raises or re-raises, there is a good chance he is holding the Ace. But what if he just calls? If he just calls, it is obvious you could put him on about anything, likely a decent Pocket Pair (QQ, TT, 88, etc.).
I just basically want to know if you guys typically have a standard for the size of an information bet and what you do with it after a call.
Did you know that participating in a poker forum can help you improve your own game? Be it by sharing experiences or simply asking for help, participation in a forum helps you focus and keep 'on topic' which will help you improve your game. You can learn from other players feedback and from their experiences. Why the THP poker forums? We offer one of the best managed texas holdem poker forums available, and the community within is far more friendly than those typicaly found on other sites. We've made a 'lurkers edition' of the poker forum available here on Holdem Poker Online, but we encourage all visitors to register and join in on the conversations on TexasHoldem-Poker.com
Posted Tue Oct 11, 2005 10:06 am GMT by Loonbat
I generally put our information bets which are 25% to 50% the size of the pot, with 30-35% being my average information bet.
Posted Tue Oct 11, 2005 11:03 am GMT by Dat_Dude
| Loonbat wrote: | | I generally put our information bets which are 25% to 50% the size of the pot, with 30-35% being my average information bet. |
That sounds like a good amount. The question I have is; What if 25-50% of the pot is actually less than the amount you raised pre-flop? Some opponents would see that as a sign of weakness that you missed the flop completely and just bluff you out of your shoes with a big raise. I suppose at that point, depending on your read, you could assume he hit the Ace or made a good bluff and let him have it?
Thanks for the response and I am interested in hearing how others play it.
Posted Tue Oct 11, 2005 1:24 pm GMT by UrAteUp
Hey Fellow Iowan.
| Quote: | Scenario 1:
Villain leads out with a modest $400-$600 bet. You obviously like your Kings and want to find out if they are any good.
|
Push with a bet that is 1 1/2x your first bet. This can do two things for you. It will let him know your serious about your hand. It could also cause him to put you on cards that you don't hold such as an AX combo. He might be on a Ax and be scared that you do have the AX( High kicker). If he flat calls you then start being worried. If he comes over the top then think fold.
| Quote: | Scenario 2:
Villain checks possibly to trap and/or try and steal the pot after inducing a decent bet from you.
|
Here I would go with a bet that matches your starting bet. It shows him that you have a strong hand by betting a second bet of 3-4xBB. It again could over value your hand in his eyes and have him putting you on an A with a high kicker.
Posted Mon Oct 24, 2005 3:11 am GMT by TheSalche
the idea here is to bet the same nearly all the time ... if you frequently raise PF 3-4x bb with hands like AK, AQ, etc. then make all your 'continuation' bets the same ... ive been getting into the habit of betting 1/2 - 2/3 the pot every time, so your opponents dont know if you're just stealin it, or if youve got it
in LP id be tempted to call a flop bet from an EP player, then bet the turn if checked to, or fold the turn if it isnt a king ... if he checks to you, you have to bet it, otherwise you're gonna be clueless
Posted Mon Oct 24, 2005 6:04 pm GMT by suitedaces84
Against passive players I often use what I call 'the information check' (TM). This is where you check to them and see if and how much they bet.
Posted Mon Oct 24, 2005 9:00 pm GMT by Skribbles
Stack sizes would definitly helps these scenarios but...
Scenario 1:
I would raise to about 1800. If he calls, you know he has an ace. BUT, against a decent player this bet may also be large enough to make him lay down a weak ace. If he does flat call then he will most likely check to you on the turn... then the decision is tough. Do you try again or is he going to call down.
Note: Raise to a point where it puts pressure on him but does not commit you to the pot or leave you short stacked.
Scenario 2:
Bet the pot. If he calls, he has the ace or something better and is trying to trap. If he is trapping, he will prolly check/raise the turn. So I'd check behind on the turn and see the river for free if you don't hit your set. If he raises, easy fold.
|
|
