Call or fold here with KK? |
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Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:09 pm GMT by Geno
I'm in a SnG, the player raising pre-flop is short and flat calls my re-raise (which was probably too small) with KK. Flop comes Ace high and he instantly shoves. I'm 90% sure he has an Ace here and played it badly pre-flop but I'm also very aware that it's a SnG and busting him is key. You can see what I did, would you agree though? 
Seat 2: Necabote (1310 in chips)
Seat 3: spookey1 (2990 in chips)
Seat 4: CHERYL1860 (3570 in chips)
Seat 6: GenoTHP (1440 in chips)
Seat 7: skid2004 (1720 in chips)
Seat 8: Pasta_T (1990 in chips)
Seat 9: pokeraddict6 (480 in chips)
skid2004: posts small blind 10
Pasta_T: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to GenoTHP  
pokeraddict6: raises 40 to 60
Necabote: folds
spookey1: folds
CHERYL1860: folds
GenoTHP: raises 140 to 200
skid2004: folds
Pasta_T: folds
pokeraddict6: calls 140
*** FLOP ***   
pokeraddict6: bets 280 and is all-in
GenoTHP: folds after much thinking
pokeraddict6 collected 430 from pot
pokeraddict6: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 430 | Rake 0
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Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:15 pm GMT by tame_deuces
He would have to shove nomatter what he had though.
I probably just call and curse a little when if I see an ace. Would still have plenty of blinds left.
Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:47 pm GMT by wEbMaStEr
This came up on another post, or similiar.
You have a whole 200 chips commited to the pot right now and are on L1 blinds, Laying it down is by far the smarter move.
You call you win you have 3000 chips
You call you lose you're out
You fold you have 1300 chips.
You do not have the best hand (potentially)
I'd rather be in with 1300 than out with, well, none.
Maybe later in the tourney if you have someone outchipped you could possibly call this. As it stands now let him take your 200 chips, an hour from now they will be the small blind.
Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 2:54 pm GMT by age_of_sages
Webby, he does have him outchipped, the guy only had 430 chips.
TBH, I don't mind the size of your reraise at all there Geno. You've got KK, you DO want one caller with that hand, and that's what you got.
As for the fold on the flop, that's tough, you're probably getting the correct pot odds for a call there, but you gotta hate those aces, and I'd agree, he probably had one.
Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 3:46 pm GMT by wEbMaStEr
Oh! mybad i just assumed.
God, that makes it trickier, he could have had all manner of hands. any A a pp or even 2 clubs. I still reckon he has a weakish ace. good fold. (but a call and a win would have been good also, a call and a loss... just stoopid  )
Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:23 pm GMT by Geno
The more I think about it, the more I think I should have called here. I have to agree with Tame when he says that the guy will probably shove no matter what but it is hard to say whether he was playing KJ, A3, 66 or just any two cards. I think I looked at this from the point of view that if I was beat, I was down to under 1,000 chips and would be waiting for cards rather than having some room to move if I folded and then got cold cards for the next 2 levels.
Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:36 pm GMT by UrAteUp
Geno I think I would have called here. Like someone said if he had the A then you can curse and come back and get him later. The EV to call this is right at +1 if memory serves me correctly but I am too lazy to do the math.
Posted Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:58 pm GMT by suitedaces84
| UrAteUp wrote: | | The EV to call this is right at +1 if memory serves me correctly but I am too lazy to do the math. |
What does this mean?
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 9:23 am GMT by Jauron
For that much, I'd have called regardless.
It's just he has so little, and it MIGHT be the jack.
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:51 pm GMT by Gunslinger
Don't know if he meant to do it, but he pulled a stop-and-go. Instead of pushing after your re-raise (which you would have instantly called), he just calls and then instantly shoves on the flop. It mostly worked because you were a middle stack, more concerned than others about conserving chips, and there was an ace on the flop (and you didn't have one). If he had any ace, with his short stack, he probably would have pushed when he opened the pot (but if he's a donk, he might not realize any of this). Good chance you had him beat, but seeing an ace and no king on the flop with KK always makes me curse.
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:11 pm GMT by BeerWench13
Due to the size of the stacks and the amount in the pot, I would have to say that I'd call here. Sure, he may have an ace, but you still have 2 cards to come and a few outs. I don't think I could've folded in this position, but it's a tough call too.
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:17 pm GMT by Skribbles
Why wouldn't you just put him all-in preflop? He raised UTG so he likes his hand and would prolly have called.
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:20 pm GMT by 1988 TR
For 2.5X your money, I think you have to call here.
He is going to push with just about anything.
It's not much of a difference if you have 1020 or 1300.
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:53 pm GMT by zinn0
I think I agree with everyone else...I make the crying call here.
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:35 pm GMT by Geno
| zinn0 wrote: | | I make the crying call here. |
I guess that is what put me off. Methink I made a mistake though 
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:24 pm GMT by Dave B
A wise old sage with a silky smooth delivery once gave me this little piece of advice:
Fold Preflop
But, not that you have chosen to play a hand and are in a mess, the magic 8 ball says:
easy call
Posted Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:47 pm GMT by xDiamond_CutteRx
'Fraid to say, you gotta call this one Geno.
I believe the EV is indeed +1, wtf ever that means.
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