2 NL hands, can you get away from these? |
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Posted Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:00 pm GMT by Dave B
Filling some rake requirements I fired up $50NL $.25/$.50 on a 2nd table. I was doing good until these 2.
2  4 in the big blind, one raised to $2 and 4 called, so I called too.
Flop K 4  2 , I hope to check raise, UTG makes it $4 (1/2 pot) all fold. I had $90, he had $26 when the hand started. I put him on a K, or a flush draw, since 44 22 would be odd (since I had the other ones) and KK limp then no reraise seemed unlikely. So I raised $10, still less than pot, but 1/2 his remaining. He called.
Turn 8, I move in, he calls w/ 44. No way. I would have been more careful if he had more, but I was willing to lose $26 there w/ that board and 2 pair.
Next 33 LP one raise to $2 and 3 callers, I call. Flop 357 rainbow. Someone comes out for $5, all fold to me, I slowplay and just call.
Turn J, he bets $10, something now smelling fishy, I just call
River blank, 10 or something, he bets $25, now I think I am dead, I call, he flopped top set w/ 77.
Should I be happy that I didnt pop him back for another $25 or feel like a dope for not following my instinct and folding? He was playing rather tight and even claimed to lay down AA and KK to all ins on the flop and no draws.
Hands like this is why I struggle to win at NL. I dont play it much, but without some good results, why bother. Am I being too lose in calling away chips? I seems like I always build a decent stack, then 1-2 hands and I am down to even again.
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Posted Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:36 pm GMT by BeerWench13
I know you had odds in the first hand, and I can't say that I wouldn't have called either, but it's questionable. Given your read and the way the hand played out, I'd have probably spent a good amount on this as well.
The second hand was just tough. Not much you can do there. You should pat yourself on the back. Unless I had a great read, I'd have raised on the turn or the river and lost more.
I don't think you're too loose. Both of these hands are rough hands and tough beats. Not much you can really do but keep at it. The swings of NL are incredible as you well know. It's a lot easier to minimize your losses in FL, so this may be where you're struggling.
Posted Mon Apr 24, 2006 2:38 pm GMT by Soup_dog
I would have lost more than you with those hands. Nothing you can do about that bud.
Posted Mon Apr 24, 2006 3:45 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
Fold preflop.
Posted Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:38 pm GMT by kingetje
i couldnt
keeping with the topic title, here are 2 hands that happened to me... both in a $.10/.20 blinds NL cash game... both by the same player who raised alot pre-flop and i saw him showdown some serious rags
who would get away from these?
middle position w/ 3-3 i limp... small blind raises 3 times big blind... we get heads up and the flop comes 3-K-T rainbow. he checks, i bet around 2/3d of the pot. he calls
turn insignificant rag, he checks i bet around the pot, he calls. river is a king, i make my full house, he bets and puts me all-in, i put him on trips kings with a nice kicker and i call,.. he shows KK for quads
then after i rebought i have K-7d on the button... limped pot, flop comes A-7-2.. everyone checks, so i bet about the pot. the dude calls... turn is a rag, he checks, i check. river is a 7, he bets pot sized i figured he has a seven, but my kicker is top so i call.. he shows A-7 for the full house... some serious slowplaying
Posted Mon Apr 24, 2006 5:27 pm GMT by tame_deuces
Win a stack, lose a stack. The way I see it that is NL. If you don't get stacked when somebody hits an overset on you, then you are either playing weak/tight or the board is (hopefully) godawful. In the end of the day the expected BB/100 isn't that high. Win a 100, lose a 100, win 50, lose 40, win 110, lose 90 etc. etc and hope somebody doesn't put you in red for the day with a bad beat.
Flopping bottom two OOP can be deadly, but as played and with that board I go broke too.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 7:34 am GMT by Poto
I really think you better fold the first hand pre-flop.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 11:42 am GMT by LeafsFan1122
He was getting like 10-1 on his money, i'd call too.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 12:24 pm GMT by crack
Didn't read any reply. I wanted to give my opnion and not be swayed.
I would more than likely fold the 24s hand preflop most of the time there. What are you hoping to hit? I wouldn't be happy with a flush in that situation and getting action.
If you do hit your miracle hand you are also out of position. Making it harder to extract chips. So you hope to hit trips or two pair on the flop, because you are probably going to be bet into on the flop. Both strong hands, but the two pair will never be top two pair. Another thing to consider.
So if i had have called it, I have hit my miracle hand. I think with a flush draw and 4 players in though I would lead out. If it is checked round you are in trouble. He raises, I can then eliminate a flush draw, unless he is a real tricky player, but this is NL50 and they are sparse.
What can he have? Top two pair? Doubt it unless he is a super loose fishy player calling K4 UTG. Set of 4's or 2's. Small chance, but not enough to concern me.
It's possible that he is being tricky with KK. Would need to know a bit about the player, like would he do the same with AK, is he a big bluffer etc.
With the information you have given, i am only worried about the KK and can't really put him on anything else that beats me and would call for half a buy in.
Your second hand is the most interesting...
This guy who had 77, where was he, ep, mp, lp? Is he a TAG or more of a rock?
Why are you playing 33? Well to hit your 3 of course. You can't ask for a much safer board if you ask me. A nice rainbow flop, someone needs 46 for a straight or 1 gappers for an OESD. Plus there was a raise so there are unlikely.
The way I see it, you have hit the money card. you also have to take into consideration that this is 50nl. Players in general overplay top pair, two pair and overpairs.
I am going all the way with this. Depening on if i think he would fire again on the river, I would either raise the turn or the river. Set v Set is a very funny scenario and very difficult to put another opponent on a higher set.
It would be interesting to know how deep your stack was and his. Thats the only way I would play it more conservatively, if there was a LOT of big blinds in both of our stacks.
Hmmm, Hope my nl theory isn't too rusty. I have only just got back into NL after a years absence playing limit.
any thoughts on my reasoning?
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 12:26 pm GMT by crack
By the way, Dave. If you want peoples true opinions, then I would hide the results and give them out later. In my experience, a some people are results orientated and would say yeah I would fold that two pair blah blah etc.
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