Posted Sat May 20, 2006 12:22 pm GMT by JohnnyCache
I've been working hard to crystallize and improve my style.
One aspect of that has been thinking about what reads I make and why.
Reads not tells, which I define as patternistic things rather then behavioral...
Here are a few of them:
1. I try to figure out if a person tends to raise with small pairs or glide with a set with them.
2. I try to figure out if they check or raise draws.
3. I try to figure out if they slowplay big pairs
4. I try to note if they raise connectors and suiteds or flop them
5. I try to notice what it means about them if they bet an odd amount
6. I try to understand if they overbet to protect or out of jumpyness with a made hand...
How am I doing?
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Posted Sat May 20, 2006 1:25 pm GMT by khaosanroad
I try to note the worst hand they are willing to start with early/mid/late.
Posted Sat May 20, 2006 1:52 pm GMT by snoogins47
Definitely some good ones there... I'm trying to think of what others stick out in my head.
I think one of the more important ones, probably moreso in NL than FL, but still important across the board is: how thin will they generally call on the flop? And this kinda ties in to the next one: how likely are they to give up after getting involved on the flop? (Obviously, on the 'reasonable' end of the spectrum the flop wusses will generally go farther after they get involved on the flop because they usually have a stronger hand, than the looser folks... and on the 'other' end of the spectrum, it may be the opposite)
This might seem abnormally important to me, because I bet like every flop. But it still matters.
Posted Sat May 20, 2006 1:58 pm GMT by JohnnyCache
"how thin" meaning "with how weak a hand?"
Posted Sun May 21, 2006 6:55 am GMT by jimmer
yeah, nice one.
I try and relate their starting hands to the amount of money in the pot and the pre-flop action.
For example, you have AQ off suit and raise pre-flop. you get one caller. the flop is 977. you both check, the next card is a Q and you bet, they raise. you end up folding and they decide to show their cards. They are holding K7 giving them trips. You are now glad you folded.
At this point most players then forget about the hand and move on. However if you look at things more closely, you realise this player called a raise pre-flop with K7. That says more to me than anything else.
(This may not be the best example, but you get the picture)
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 12:57 am GMT by JohnnyCache
See, that's the other skill I'm trying to work on - storing the action on a hand in short term memory long enough and well enough to put it in context at the end of the hand. Letting my attention waver and forgetting to do this is my biggest weakness.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 2:18 am GMT by jimmer
This i fairly easy to sort. Find the player at your table who plays the most hands and concentrate on them ONLY. No one else. You're effectively picking on them. Once you've worked out how they play, move on to someone else. I would suggest if you are at a table for one hour+ you should be able to build profile's on two-to-three players. before you know it you will notice things about all the players and this will be second nature.
I like to take this one step further and study the players before i sit at the table. i try and find at least three players at one table, who i consider to be weak. i then sit at the table and target them. if they leave.....so do i.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 2:30 am GMT by JohnnyCache
oh, I know how to do it, just like I know how to do a situp, but lately I've been really working on making myself actually do it on a regular basis, (much like doing a situp)
Perhaps if a pretty lady occasionlly complemented my improving reads as they do my shrinking waist . . .
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 7:45 am GMT by UrAteUp
It's one of the harder things to get yourself to do while your setting playing online poker. You can think of a million things you would rather do then to try to read the other players or make notes on their play, but once you condition yourself to do it then it becomes second nature.
Keep good track of those idiots who will call a 3-4xBB raise with marginal hands like K7. These are soon to be your chip suppliers.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 8:27 am GMT by jimmer
| JohnnyCache wrote: | | oh, I know how to do it, just like I know how to do a situp |
poker=good
situp's=bad
never, ever put poker in the same catogory as exercise!
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 8:32 am GMT by UrAteUp
| jimmer wrote: |
never, ever put poker in the same catogory as exercise! |
Poker is exercise...for the brain.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 8:55 am GMT by jimmer
| UrAteUp wrote: | | Poker is exercise...for the brain. |
One will prolong your life, the other IS life!
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 8:59 am GMT by JohnnyCache
| jimmer wrote: | | JohnnyCache wrote: | | oh, I know how to do it, just like I know how to do a situp |
poker=good
situp's=bad
never, ever put poker in the same catogory as exercise! |
It's a fact that moderate excercise de-inhibits memory function.
The best poker player will be a guy with a balanced life . . .ah . . . or greg raymer...
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 10:07 am GMT by jimmer
i know , i'm kinda pulling your leg.
i worked as a fitness instructor from the age of 18-24. then i hurt my back and ate pie's for 6 years.
i've sat on both sides of the fence and can see both points of view. poker just so happens to be the "flavour of the month" at the mo.
Posted Mon May 22, 2006 5:58 pm GMT by foldhappy
This is a good idea Johnny. I doubt if most people pay attention as much as they should when out of a hand playing online. Sooo many distractions, all they have to do is look at their hand every minute or so and click. In person you've got more you can focus on, plus you're trying to be unreadable yourself, so the motivation is a little more apparent. I love playing on 6-max tables, where you can get your reads a lot faster. Some of the things you mention there are magnified, such as raising with draws etc. Some other things that come up a LOT more in short handed, but might also apply to your games:
-What do they need to steal with and how often do they do it?
-What do they defend the blinds with
-How big of a hand do they need to raise from the blinds (a lot of players even shorthanded will only raise high pp and AK from here)
-Can they let go of a premium starting hand on an unfriendly flop or will they go down in flames and call you a donk for knowing how to play the flop
-I think this one says something about their aggression: do they raise or limp in with mediocre (say K-10o) hands from late position when it's been folded to them.
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