Has Daniel Negreanu Lost It? |
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Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:44 pm GMT by wEbMaStEr
Discuss.
I'll kick the discussion off...
Let us consider his play in HSP (High Stakes Poker obv.) He seems completely unable to lay down a good hand! These guy's are NOT making $60-70K bluffs Daniel! Learn to lay your goddamn hands down when you KNOW you are beat! That's about 5 times now you've made crying calls, admitting you have no idea what your opp can have! Well guess what they have Daniel... YOU BEAT! Lay your fricking hands down!
His play in the WSOP, ok so he got deep(ish) but come on! You have a really great stack at one point and what do you do Daniel? What do you do? You donk it off trying to 'outplay' people when your rags miss. Stop being a donk!
Taking a step down, by his own admission he lost $1 mill in a session at the big game, he says it will be a while before he plays at that level again. Maybe if you weren't such a donk... ???
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Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:57 pm GMT by tame_deuces
Run good and everybody says you are a god, run bad and everybody says you are a moron. Maybe the truth is a little more complex.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 1:04 pm GMT by arras
I think in regards to HSP he just got on bad monkey tilt, but overall I do like his style.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 1:22 pm GMT by UrAteUp
I think he suffered from FPS (fancy play syndrome) during the WSOP. As for his play at the HSP he does have a major flaw in his game and that is the inability to lay down a hand when he knows he is beat. I hope these are not long term problems and he gets back to playing ABC poker and not fish poker or donkey poker.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 2:40 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
| wEbMaStEr wrote: | Let us consider his play in HSP (High Stakes Poker obv.) He seems completely unable to lay down a good hand! These guy's are NOT making $60-70K bluffs Daniel! Learn to lay your goddamn hands down when you KNOW you are beat! That's about 5 times now you've made crying calls, admitting you have no idea what your opp can have! Well guess what they have Daniel... YOU BEAT! Lay your fricking hands down!
His play in the WSOP, ok so he got deep(ish) but come on! You have a really great stack at one point and what do you do Daniel? What do you do? You donk it off trying to 'outplay' people when your rags miss. Stop being a donk!
Taking a step down, by his own admission he lost $1 mill in a session at the big game, he says it will be a while before he plays at that level again. Maybe if you weren't such a donk... ??? |
I completely disagree with you. This has got to be the worst accusation ever, sorry.
Don't call players who are 100x better than you donks or question their plays and ability.
I am am a big fan of DN, but that has nothing to do with the fact that I'm arguing this. I don't like when cocky amateurs start to question the knowledge of a professional player. They are professionals for a reason, and that is because they know what the heck they are doing.
Just to clairify, if this post was about any other professional, my answer would be the same.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 2:53 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: | | I don't like when cocky amateurs start to question the knowledge of a professional player. They are professionals for a reason, and that is because they know what the heck they are doing. |
Flip side of the same coin, you can't be sure he's on his game either, right?
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:04 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
He could definately not be at the top of his game. Personally I don't beleive he is either, but this topic suggests he's a "donk", which is ridiculous.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:08 pm GMT by Johny
We had a similar discussion about Brunson, where he was branded as being mediocre.
You know what's funny, some people actually think they can play as good as or better then some of the best players in the world. Not anyone from this forum in particular though.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:19 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: | | He could definately not be at the top of his game. Personally I don't beleive he is either, but this topic suggests he's a "donk", which is ridiculous. |
What constitutes a donk besides someone who is consistently making bad decisions, regardless of how transient that condition may be?
Regardless of how much you know or how much success you've had in the past, if you're currently losing consistently because of poor play, then you may be a donkey.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:32 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
Everyone goes through rough dryspells below their standards. For Daniel, it's bin slightly longer than some of the other pros. DN still managed to place in several WSOP events this year which to me seems like a decent accomplishment.
A "donk" though is suppose to be a bad player. A player who has no clue about the game and basic strategy.
I understand that he hasn't done a hell of a lot latley, but DN is young, which is another reason why I still have yet even more confidence that he'll climb up to the top of his game in the near future and have another dominating year.
I still don't like when average players knock the pros - that's mainly why I wrote my original post here.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:34 pm GMT by snoogins47
The appalling thing is that anybody here thinks they have enough of an understanding of the game, and even 1/100th the information required to actually figure out how good/bad these players are, whether it be at their peak or right now.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:45 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| snoogins47 wrote: | | The appalling thing is that anybody here thinks they have enough of an understanding of the game, and even 1/100th the information required to actually figure out how good/bad these players are, whether it be at their peak or right now. |
I don't even have 1/100th the impetus to gain that 1/100th of required knowledge.
I'm disinterested to 4 or 5 significant digits.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:01 pm GMT by wEbMaStEr
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: |
I completely disagree with you. This has got to be the worst accusation ever, sorry.
Don't call players who are 100x better than you donks or question their plays and ability.
I am am a big fan of DN, but that has nothing to do with the fact that I'm arguing this. I don't like when cocky amateurs start to question the knowledge of a professional player. They are professionals for a reason, and that is because they know what the heck they are doing.
Just to clairify, if this post was about any other professional, my answer would be the same. |
WHOAAAHH!!!
Now just you hang on there a minute boy, I'm sorry if i insulted your girlfriend there but there really is no need for you to get so personal in your outburst!
I know a lot of kids hang on DN as if he is some kind of god-like-genius/philanthropic messiah, but just because someone chooses to disagree with your deification of him is no need to go bandying around phrases like "cocky amateurs" or refusing my right to ask a legitimate question or give my opinion on an open forum for the purposes of stimulating discussion.
I would not have as much of a problem with your ridiculous defence if you had actually used an argument to refute my points! but no, you chose instead to whine in that tiny voice, typical of DN sychophants, to blurt out "Leave Dan alone, he's my hero, you'll never be as good as he is, I want to give him a big girly kiss on his bottom!"
Try using points and counterpoints next time, you know, rather than just making unsubstantiated claims and accusations.
Pathetic rebuttal leafs, F-
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:10 pm GMT by UrAteUp
| snoogins47 wrote: | | The appalling thing is that anybody here thinks they have enough of an understanding of the game, and even 1/100th the information required to actually figure out how good/bad these players are, whether it be at their peak or right now. |
I do...I do...read the sig. It says it all Snoo...I am simply the best... :D. I don't think I have 1/100th of an idea. I have 50/100th of an idea. I am half way there buddy and going strong... :D
Leafs relax buddy. Don't blow a gasket on Webby's comments. We each have our own opinions and we all have a favorite player or two. Personally I like that Tilly and Harmon, but for other reasons besides their poker ability.
I think Webby was just pointing out that DN has been on a bad play stretch as of late from what we see on TV. Doesn't mean it is true though. It could be just how the TV people want to make him look. There are probably tournaments and games he is playing in where he is doing well and making good plays. The important thing is this is just Webbys opinion. Just as you have your opinions.
Just for the record:
wEbMaStEr = cocky amatuer....   ...i love it...Webby you should make that your sig....
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:13 pm GMT by Johny
Discussing how good or bad the name pros are: -EV.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:15 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
| wEbMaStEr wrote: | | LeafsFan1122 wrote: |
I completely disagree with you. This has got to be the worst accusation ever, sorry.
Don't call players who are 100x better than you donks or question their plays and ability.
I am am a big fan of DN, but that has nothing to do with the fact that I'm arguing this. I don't like when cocky amateurs start to question the knowledge of a professional player. They are professionals for a reason, and that is because they know what the heck they are doing.
Just to clairify, if this post was about any other professional, my answer would be the same. |
WHOAAAHH!!!
Now just you hang on there a minute boy, I'm sorry if i insulted your girlfriend there but there really is no need for you to get so personal in your outburst!
I know a lot of kids hang on DN as if he is some kind of god-like-genius/philanthropic messiah, but just because someone chooses to disagree with your deification of him is no need to go bandying around phrases like "cocky amateurs" or refusing my right to ask a legitimate question or give my opinion on an open forum for the purposes of stimulating discussion.
I would not have as much of a problem with your ridiculous defence if you had actually used an argument to refute my points! but no, you chose instead to whine in that tiny voice, typical of DN sychophants, to blurt out "Leave Dan alone, he's my hero, you'll never be as good as he is, I want to give him a big girly kiss on his bottom!"
Try using points and counterpoints next time, you know, rather than just making unsubstantiated claims and accusations.
Pathetic rebuttal leafs, F- |
Webby,
First off, thanks for practically discriminating against me for being younger than you, I enjoyed that.
I'd like to let you know that I wasn't specifically calling you out and saying that I thought you were a cocky amateur, sorry if you saw it like that, but my post was not intended to be like that.
Admittably I'm not as good as a writer as many people here, but I didn't think you'd be arrogant enough as to 'grade' my response to you.
You asked a question, and got a response. You of all people should know that when you ask a question involving two seperate possible answers, that the replies will be divided.
You just proved to me that you indeed, ARE arrogant enough to think you're better than a pro poker player.
't
Really I don't have much else to say. Your post was stupid, your thoughts towards me are stupid.
I need to go now, can't finish the post. More on this later.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:20 pm GMT by zeroswarm
I've seen different pro players play appallingly badly on tv quite a lot of times.
It sometimes makes you wonder just how good they actually are but its hard to judge fairly on the limited number of hands you see.
The difference really is that when a pro is losing he's running bad. When a nobody is losing he's always a donk.....
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:58 pm GMT by Skribbles
DN wears hockey jerseys on TV. Us Canucks are forced to like him eh.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 5:03 pm GMT by wEbMaStEr
You're comments were not directed at me? I thought they were, they did sound that way.
My grading of you was not to do with your writing abilities but rather the rebuttal of my arguments, as a rebuttal, it wasn't.
I had no idea how old you were, but your response was that of a kid who's hero had been slighted.
I asked a question to get responses, to provoke responses even, what i did not ask for were personal attacks.
I am arrogant! I AM even cocky! Whether or not I am better than any particular pro remains to be seen.
My thoughts towards you, I don't really have any. My thoughts towards your response tho, i think, were spot on.
As for my post being stupid, we're not allowed to discuss the relative merits of various poker players now? On a poker forum? Really?
Ok, then i expect never to see another post lambasting Mike Matusow for being a degenerate gambler and all round failure as a human being?
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 5:24 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
I was in a rush while writing my last post so it didn't come out too well.
I still think you have no right or authority to say DN is a donk.
Your response back to me was childish. My reply was not angry and rude towards you, while yours back to me was.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 5:48 pm GMT by Gunslinger
Can there be one disagreement on this forum without people getting their panties in a wad and taking everything personally?
In regards to the original subject, I'm not agreeing or disagreeing about Daniel N. specifically, but everything we see on TV has been edited for entertainment. ESPECIALLY the ESPN WSOP broadcasts. Not only do they choose which hands we see, but the Lon/Norman commentary and profiling (recorded well after the tournie is over) is scripted to make the show more interesting. The action we see on any given hand, is well out of context for that person's table image, and their overall tournie play. A good case in point is Dmitri Nobles. During the actual ME, the PokerStars blog followed him very closely (being a Stars qualifier), and had many hands and stories of moves and plays he made not only to get his large chip stack, but then use it agressively, and very effectively on many occasions. The ESPN episode from yesterday just shows him as a maniac who donks off a lot of chips, another "early chip leader who really doesn't have the fortitude to maintain his lead". Bottom line, I couldn't judge a pro OR an amateur based on what some ESPN producer and picture editor decides will be the most interesting to the mass audience.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:12 pm GMT by swiftone
Lets try to get this discussion back on track here.
I for one am inclined to agree with webmaster on this one. Seeing DN play at the WSOP Tunica (or at least the first two episodes- havent seen the last one) reinforced this opinion of mine. Every featured hand shown with DN was exactly as Webmatser stated it- a crying call on the river with a 2nd best hand. In fact, the only pot I recall him taking down was when he rivered two pair.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:23 pm GMT by zinn0
| Gunslinger wrote: | | Can there be one disagreement on this forum without people getting their panties in a wad and taking everything personally? |
In a word: no.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 6:48 pm GMT by Fat Tony
| zinn0 wrote: | | Gunslinger wrote: | | Can there be one disagreement on this forum without people getting their panties in a wad and taking everything personally? |
In a word: no. |
That's pretty sad, and it needs to change. People need to grow up and understand that simply disagreeing with their opinion does not equate a personal attack. This is not aimed at anyone in particular, it's a general statement.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:15 pm GMT by mackkie
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: |
I completely disagree with you. |
Clearly you are from Canada...gotta defend your boys  :D
IMO he has donked off a lot of $ trying to overplay situations. From what i have seen he just hates laying down hands.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:02 pm GMT by Johny
Wow, just wow. Negreanu isn't a donk, give me a break, seriously.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:03 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
No Johny, listen to the experts.
Negreanu is a donk, and they are the microlimit superstars.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:15 pm GMT by mackkie
LOL the Canadians are teaming up now!!! I am loving it... 
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:15 pm GMT by kingetje
just because he lost a few big pots in HSP doesnt mean necessarily he was playing bad. he flops a few nut straigts and runs into full houses, or with boats running into quads... if youre playing in your home game you are paying it off as well
and people say he cant lay down hands is kind of over the top... i remember a HSP episode where he folded the nut flush when he made it on the river as the board paired
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:27 pm GMT by Johny
| mackkie wrote: | | LOL the Canadians are teaming up now!!! I am loving it... |
Yeah, it's hilarious.
I would invite Leafs over to my house to discuss this but the front door to my igloo is frozen shut.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:31 pm GMT by Skribbles
This forum has hit an all-time low....
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:51 pm GMT by mackkie
| Johny wrote: |
I would invite Leafs over to my house to discuss this but the front door to my igloo is frozen shut. |
Yikes, just joking around...looks like someone is getting a little upset  8)
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:51 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
Everyone gets upset.
That's what a poker forum is suppose to do, isn't it?
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:54 pm GMT by Fat Tony
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: | Everyone gets upset.
That's what a poker forum is suppose to do, isn't it? |
No, it isn't.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:55 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
I was being sarcastic.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:55 pm GMT by Fat Tony
I wasn't.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 9:12 pm GMT by Johny
| mackkie wrote: | | Yikes, just joking around...looks like someone is getting a little upset 8) |
I'm not upset. I'm more annoyed than anything. I just made a joke to vent.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 9:19 pm GMT by mackkie
| Johny wrote: |
I'm not upset. I'm more annoyed than anything. I just made a joke to vent. |
Ok, guess i took that the wrong way. But now that I think about it and watching daniel on the PPT right now I came to my senses and realized that this question is pretty nuts, hes a solid player and a good pick for any tourney he is in.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 9:39 pm GMT by shorn7
Wow...I leave for one day and this place has become 2+2. Let's everyone relax and take a chill. Each and every one of us is entitled to our opinion...that is the definition of "open forum". Now to the topic at hand:
I have a lot of respect for Daniel. I think he is cionsistently one of the best writers in CP and has a lot of good ideas on hand reading and strategy. Clearly, he is in the upper echelon of pro's out there IMO.
That being said, his play on last nights episode of HSP was atrocious. Especially the las hand against Lindgren...that was a clear fold on the river and DN knew it as soon as Erik declared all-in. He just didn't follow through. I think he was on tilt and let his dibelief in flopping so many strong hands getting cracked get the best of him. This in no way diminishes his skill as a player or is a determining factor in whether he is a top player or not. It was just a bad session that all started with the hand against Gus.
Let's be honest...we all go on tilt and make calls we have no business making. No one is immune from this behavior, including the top pro's. And, in all fairness, I think taking a few epsiodes of HSP and making a determination that someone has lost it is out of context (again, IMO...no disrespect Web).
Anyway, lets all try and get back to sharing ideas and not posting flame mails. I would hate to have to leave this forum due to nothing but testpsterone flow.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 9:51 pm GMT by suitedaces84
| tame_deuces wrote: | | Run good and everybody says you are a god, run bad and everybody says you are a moron. Maybe the truth is a little more complex. |
This is correct. The amount of luck involved in small amount of poker is large. Also consider that a top pro's edge is very small in these games. Most decent players playing their small games have a bigger edge than the better players in these games. It's very silly to try to determine the quality of a player or how well he played based on these results.
But I guess everyone is an expert when they can see the other guy's cards.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 10:10 pm GMT by JackKingOff
Why dont you ladies stop fighting and just face facts... he can't possibly be a donk... if he were a donk... he would never have made it pro in the first place being from setbacks such as going broke multiple times. And hes made more than most of us ever will in a lifetime and he's still very young like Leafs said. He can still improve and hes got plenty of time to do it.
Posted Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:36 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| suitedaces84 wrote: | | But I guess everyone is an expert when they can see the other guy's cards. |
Hansen could show his quads, and there's a reasonable chance I would still call.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:53 am GMT by groton
okay
Lets see in the last Four Days Iv seen him on HSP,WSOP Me and PPT.
first thats a ton of Air time
I think he played somewhat Decent on WSOP ME (not great but he did have his reads made a couple decent laydowns and stuff)
on PPT he did better But EDog did bluff the Shit out of him that one hand (which kinda sets up The reason i think he Called Edog's All in )
HSP what can I say here He Played like a DONK I mean I expeect Phill Hellmouth to play this bad in a ring game not the Great Canadian Hope
but at the same time I had a DN moment on Tuesday night when i floped Trips bad kicker vs Trips Better Kicker I had the Bad kicker and went out since i put the Guy on the second best hand 
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:58 am GMT by wEbMaStEr
I am NOT talking about a few hands shown on espn. Did any of you follow the hand updates on cardplayer during the wsop? But talking of espn... "I have folded exactly 14 hands."
I am NOT talking about 1 hand on HSP, I believe i said at the time of the Hansen hand, "I defy anybody to make a laydown there" But rather his overall play. Making a crying call, even if it's just for information, is ok, it happens, making 5 of them in a short period of time is bad mmmkay
I am sorry that you guys feel insulted because i have critiicised a national hero or something, but i think the dude needs to pull himself together.
Obviously to have "Lost it" he had to "have it" at some point, that is not in dispute here.
The question is, has he lost it? You guys (mostly Canadian) guys seem to think he hasn't. That's fine, would still be nice if you could provide reasons for his not losing it rather than just crying foul and saying i am not allowed to question the great one.
CELINE DION HAS A FACE LIKE A HORSE!
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:02 am GMT by groton
web
what i am saying is he has not lost it.
but i am saying that he is not playing all that good and the PPT showed me some Insight.
read my post from earlyer today when i posted my Trip vs Trip hand
realy i think his main problem is also mine.
He Tends to Put someoen on One Hand and then No mater what else happens He is Locked in.
rarly does he change his mind on a hand if He Call's the River the Vast Majorty he will kill some time and call on teh river also which i also tend to do expecaly If i pigenhole someone into a hand I can Beat and that hand does not IMprove and he has a much better hand
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 4:11 am GMT by MrDarling
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 6:35 am GMT by UrAteUp
I think everyone needs to calm down, step back and take a look at this entire post and see why this forum is being divided on such a small issue. Yes DN has had some bad runs. Who doesn't. I don't think he is a real doink because he has ability as many of the pros do. I do not feel it is worth "getting my panties in a wad" to discuss if DN or any pro is a doink or not. I feel it is more important to learn by watching pros play and from reading this forum and what it's members have to post. There is alot of wisdom here in this forum and much to learn from it.
Now lets all come out of our corners with a big hug and stop the fighting...
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 7:48 am GMT by Iron Butt
On topic: I don't see how DN could play at the levels he does for long if he wasn't very very good. It's interesting that he feels he has to make those calls... maybe if you don't demonstrate regularly that you're willing to call off half a million just to see 'em you get eaten up at that level.
Off topic: Not referring to anyone in particular, but the whole "you're not qualified to have an opinion" thing raised here really bugs me especially since it seems you hear it a lot these days often about things that the essence of which is public opinion. We all have the same right to an opinion about DN's poker that we do to judge Johnny Depp's acting or Randy Johnson's pitching or various other issues I'll stay the hell away from etc. etc.: We pay the bills, dammit. We support the tournaments, TV shows, etc., they only exist because we take an interest. Jeez, it's just a bull session anyway, don't let anyone tell you you're not qualified to BS.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 7:52 am GMT by Oasis
Webby, you are a demeaning, inconsiderate moron.
That is all.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 8:01 am GMT by Dave B
Daniel had a successfully 2006. He won a WSOP circuit event, he made several other MAJOR final tables, he did well in the main event.
He had a HUGE 2004 (I think it was 2004 wasnt it?) and a quieter 2005. When he said he dropped a million on the big game, he claimed to win it back in the next 2-3 sessions.
You cant measure a player on a few hands. You need to see if they are successful. His "outplaying" someone w/ 74 sets up a LOT of calls with he has AK QQ.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 8:35 am GMT by gumbie
I choose option 3
3. DN has always been a DoNk
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:27 am GMT by ScanX
are u out of your mind webby ?
ok he made some shitty calls in last eps of High Stakes, but calling him a donk just cause of that (or cause his ME) is exagerated and you know it.
You forget all the guy has accomplished just cause u saw 3 hands on TV and read some log on internet ? sorry, but lol.
did u forget the hand where he had QT and reraised w/ 2nd pair after farha pushed all-in cause he knew he had Chamanara (or that he could make him fold a weak top pair) and he knew he had farha beat ?
that was genius play, but who cares, negreanu made 3 stupid calls !!!!!
please get real.
PS : yes I'm a big negreanu fan, but it doesnt matter cause u gotta have shit in the eyes to deny he's still one of the best.
I'm also a fan of Hellmuth cause he's such good TV, but I have no problem saying the guy is a donk at cash game
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:31 am GMT by jimmer
I'm asking a question, more than i'm stating a fact.
On the whole, surely DN plays the same (high stakes) players over and over again?????
Therefore he needs to adapt his game accordingly. Therefore, playing the occational T3 off suit and 86 offsuit, then raising big when he's out-flopped is all part of the act.
I guess it's a bit like Gus Hansen raising every pot.
Isn't it???
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:35 am GMT by ScanX
| jimmer wrote: | I'm asking a question, more than i'm stating a fact.
On the whole, surely DN plays the same (high stakes) players over and over again?????
Therefore he needs to adapt his game accordingly. Therefore, playing the occational T3 off suit and 86 offsuit, then raising big when he's out-flopped is all part of the act.
I guess it's a bit like Gus Hansen raising every pot.
Isn't it??? |
the preflop play of daniel is fine...he plays a lot of hands but he plays them well (not too passively)
it's just his postflop play that has been a bit shitty lately...calling when it's an obvious fold.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:55 am GMT by Sean_in_NJ
I like ice cream.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:51 am GMT by wEbMaStEr
Thank you to all who took the time to post well considered, reasonable points pro & anti the topic question. You are valuable members of this forum and I have the utmost respect for your opinions whether they agree with mine or not.
| Oasis wrote: | Webby, you are a demeaning, inconsiderate moron.
That is all. |
Others are just twats
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:26 am GMT by Oasis
Got martyr?
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:28 am GMT by wEbMaStEr
Got banned?
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:33 am GMT by cayouche
Those last few hands showed that everyone can have bad times...
- Surely against GH, quads vs. FH, shit happens...
- Elezra was very aggressive, and EE's 66 vs. DN's 53 where DN flops the nuts. The only hands really that EE could've had that would beat DN, was 66, 44. Since 78, 73, 62, 42 and 52 were unlikely, it was +EV to call.
- His J8 when he had top pair could be debatable though.
- Now, 9T vs. 88, just bad luck. The river call could be debatable again, but I still believe that many players wouldn't be able to lay that hand down.
For sure though, DN has made better decisions in the past. However, I don't believe it's fair to label him a donk for a few unlucky hands and two questionnable calls.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:26 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
The conflict here has gone way out of proportion.
Webby, I'm sorry if I insulted you in my original reply, it was far more harsh than it should have been.
Hopefully we can all get along a bit better.
About DN, I think Dave hit the nail on the head.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:21 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | I like ice cream. |
Sometimes with sprinkles. Sometimes without.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:40 pm GMT by arras
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | I like ice cream. |
Sometimes with sprinkles. Sometimes without. |
Sprinkles are just for ice cream that isn't good on its own.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:42 pm GMT by UrAteUp
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | I like ice cream. |
Sometimes with sprinkles. Sometimes without. |
Cone or dish though Sean?... ...and what flavor?... ...that has some major importance too you know....
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:43 pm GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| arras wrote: | | Sprinkles are just for ice cream that isn't good on its own. |
HOWZ ABOUT I SPRINKLE SOME BANNED ON YOUR ASS?
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:44 pm GMT by UrAteUp
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: | The conflict here has gone way out of proportion.
Webby, I'm sorry if I insulted you in my original reply, it was far more harsh than it should have been.
Hopefully we can all get along a bit better.
About DN, I think Dave hit the nail on the head. |
This is how we assure some kind of unity on this forum. Well done Leafs. Admiting when you got carried away is a big step and a step of a true man...even if you are Canadian buddy.. ...
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:56 pm GMT by wEbMaStEr
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: | The conflict here has gone way out of proportion.
Webby, I'm sorry if I insulted you in my original reply, it was far more harsh than it should have been.
Hopefully we can all get along a bit better.
About DN, I think Dave hit the nail on the head. |
Ok, you have given reasons for your original response, I accept this and the reasons for my response to yours were this miscommunication and that is the sole reason for my response. I apologise for my insults.
As far as I'm concerned we can move on with no ill-feeling.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 5:29 pm GMT by suitedaces84
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | HOWZ ABOUT I SPRINKLE SOME BANNED ON YOUR ASS? |
vnh
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 5:52 pm GMT by snoogins47
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | I like ice cream. |
Sometimes with sprinkles. Sometimes without. |
The Peanut Brittle Crunchy Sprinkles are way better than those rainbow ones.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:34 pm GMT by Gunslinger
| Oasis wrote: | Webby, you are a demeaning, inconsiderate moron.
That is all. |
Ad hominem, personal attacks like this are pathetic. Both Webby and Leafs have calmed down and behaved like adults and listened to each other. Throwing a statement like this into a thread is less than useless.
Posted Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:36 pm GMT by efram
ie tits on a boar
Posted Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:47 pm GMT by MrDarling
I've just seen few High Stakes clips from episode 13.. I have to say, those are some bad beats - wont even come close to call these move donkish.
For God shake, they guy flopped the nuts 3 or 4 times...
how could anyone fold the hands he didn't fold...
Posted Sat Sep 09, 2006 3:09 am GMT by ShavedNuTs
He just got third in the PPT. He is good.
The HSP is only a small glimpse of his cash game.
Posted Sat Sep 09, 2006 7:59 pm GMT by NickHow
Just want to point out that if people weren't allowed to question the ability of people 100x better than them no-one would bother watching professional sports.
Posted Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:00 pm GMT by LeafsFan1122
I played tennis once.....Andy Roddick and Andre Agassi suck.
Posted Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:49 pm GMT by mrcfkane
yeah daniel sucks....he can't even stop his opponents from hitting quads
Posted Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:40 am GMT by MrDarling
| LeafsFan1122 wrote: | | I played tennis once.....Andy Roddick and Andre Agassi suck. |
Real Leaf , you're not seriously thinking one can't have an opinion on others abilities even if they are much much better then him?
So you really never comment on actors / singers ability? You never said this Rock Group sucks - even though they sold millions of records and you probably sold.... none?
I mean no offense to you or DN, in fact, from the very few episodes I've seen DN play I think he is a great player , usually makes great reads and great moves. Is it possible that he is tilting? sure it is!
Do I think he is? From the one High Stake episode I've seen , defiantly no - he just got real bad luck. Sure, he could have not slow played his flopped nuts, but then his winning pots would have been much smaller.
btw, few of the players on that episode remarked that :
they never seen such a cold run... and someone even had a tell on DN how do you know when DN has a str8? - the board pairs
Posted Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:52 am GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | I like ice cream. |
Sometimes with sprinkles. Sometimes without. |
Whipped cream is almost a requirement though. I simply can't imagine what people did before then.
Posted Sun Sep 10, 2006 1:41 pm GMT by jimmer
| Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | Sean_in_NJ wrote: | | I like ice cream. |
Sometimes with sprinkles. Sometimes without. |
Whipped cream is almost a requirement though. I simply can't imagine what people did before then. |
Whipped icecream is the best. I mean if i'm in the supermarket, then hagin-das or ben and jerrys will do. But mr whippy, from an icecream van always wins.
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