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a hand i took some crap on |
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Posted Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:35 pm GMT by Ensano
now there's quite a large range villian could have here to reraise me... 99/AQo/AQs and up...
if he puts me on a steal attempt then there could a'so be 77/88/A10/AJ...
since i'm getting 3.78:1 to call in OTB would i be correc to call and play cautiously due to limp/caller?...
POKERSTARS GAME #10466251612: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($0.25/$0.50) - 2007/06/16 - 15:20:33 (ET)
Table 'Kiviuq V' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: eze18700 ($88 in chips)
Seat 2: chubby dubby ($49.50 in chips)
Seat 3: CheckyChecky ($42.90 in chips)
Seat 4: dennisa ($14.40 in chips)
Seat 5: vermine ($52.35 in chips)
Seat 6: SalvadorDali ($31.95 in chips)
Seat 7: Ensano ($48.50 in chips)
Seat 8: SlyJeff ($50.25 in chips)
Seat 9: piipi ($61.55 in chips)
SlyJeff: posts small blind $0.25
piipi: posts big blind $0.50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Ensano  
eze18700: folds
chubby dubby: calls $0.50
CheckyChecky: folds
dennisa: folds
vermine: folds
SalvadorDali: folds
Ensano: raises $1.50 to $2
SlyJeff: folds
piipi: raises $3.50 to $5.50
chubby dubby: calls $5
Ensano: ?
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Posted Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:56 pm GMT by General Sal
Hmmm... I don't think you should be worried about the limp/caller, it's obvious he has some kind of small pair or suited connector. He could have a weak ace or something like that. Remember he didn't raise.
The other guy though has reraised behind you and you really should be worried about that one. AJ is not really the kind of hand you want to call a re-raise with. But, you are closing the betting. If he's a loose guy, maybe it's not so bad to call, but if it's a tight one or dangerous playa' then you're definitely in trouble.
Posted Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:39 am GMT by supafrey
Pretty easy fold.
Posted Sun Jun 17, 2007 2:53 pm GMT by JD999
| General Sal wrote: | Hmmm... I don't think you should be worried about the limp/caller, it's obvious he has some kind of small pair or suited connector. He could have a weak ace or something like that. Remember he didn't raise.
The other guy though has reraised behind you and you really should be worried about that one. AJ is not really the kind of hand you want to call a re-raise with. But, you are closing the betting. If he's a loose guy, maybe it's not so bad to call, but if it's a tight one or dangerous playa' then you're definitely in trouble. |
Calling a Re-raise and a Caller with AJ is iffy. AJ can't be good with a re-raise and a caller. I disagree with General Sal when he says don't worry about the limper-caller. He limped early position, and called 5 bucks after only investing 50 cents. Either he is slow playing a strong handand will let his competition do the betting for him, or he is a very weak call-station-like player.
Sal is totally right about the re-raiser for sure, and even without the limper-caller, I would fold AJ here because of the re-raise. He probably would not put you on a steal because there was a limper previously in the pot. Stealers usually steal when the action is folded around to them in the cutoff or button.
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 8:33 am GMT by UrAteUp
A re-raise and a flat call in front of you. My thinking is your AJ is no good here. Lay it down while you can.
Something tells me though by the title of this post that he makes the call, stacks at least one player and takes over my donktastic title...all the while riding his little blue scooter... 
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 11:37 am GMT by Ensano
not the way i see it here either my A is good or someone is slowplaying a monster...
AA is still not out of the question by EP limp/caller...
POKERSTARS GAME #10466251612: HOLD'EM NO LIMIT ($0.25/$0.50) - 2007/06/16 - 15:20:33 (ET)
Table 'Kiviuq V' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: eze18700 ($88 in chips)
Seat 2: chubby dubby ($49.50 in chips)
Seat 3: CheckyChecky ($42.90 in chips)
Seat 4: dennisa ($14.40 in chips)
Seat 5: vermine ($52.35 in chips)
Seat 6: SalvadorDali ($31.95 in chips)
Seat 7: Ensano ($48.50 in chips)
Seat 8: SlyJeff ($50.25 in chips)
Seat 9: piipi ($61.55 in chips)
SlyJeff: posts small blind $0.25
piipi: posts big blind $0.50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Ensano
eze18700: folds
chubby dubby: calls $0.50
CheckyChecky: folds
dennisa: folds
vermine: folds
SalvadorDali: folds
Ensano: raises $1.50 to $2
SlyJeff: folds
piipi: raises $3.50 to $5.50
chubby dubby: calls $5
Ensano: calls $3.50
*** FLOP ***   
piipi: checks
chubby dubby: checks
Ensano: checks
*** TURN *** 
piipi: checks
chubby dubby: bets $3
Ensano: ?
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 11:48 am GMT by Kalbelgarion
Such a tiny bet, I'd call. I don't see the advantage of raising here. You have top pair with a J kicker, with no flush draws or realistic straight draws on the board. Aside from someone hitting a set, there's no way anyone can draw out on you.
Call, and if the other villain check/raises, fold. Get to showdown as cheaply as possible. Remember--Small pots for small hands.
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:18 pm GMT by mortaleclipse
i belive the range of hands you could be against is to hard to break down. keeping the pot small is by far smartest move.
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:23 pm GMT by Ensano
agreed on both....
*** FLOP ***
piipi: checks
chubby dubby: checks
Ensano: checks
*** TURN ***
piipi: checks
chubby dubby: bets $3
Ensano: calls $3
piipi: calls $3
*** RIVER *** 
piipi: checks
chubby dubby: checks
Ensano: checks (no need to risk a c/r... just close the betting already)
*** SHOW DOWN ***
piipi: shows   (two pair, Kings and Fours)
chubby dubby: mucks hand
Ensano: shows (two pair, Aces and Fours)
Ensano collected $24.55 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $25.75 | Rake $1.20
Board
Seat 1: eze18700 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: chubby dubby mucked  
Seat 3: CheckyChecky folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: dennisa folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: vermine folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: SalvadorDali folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Ensano (button) showed and won ($24.55) with two pair, Aces and Fours
Seat 8: SlyJeff (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: piipi (big blind) showed and lost with two pair, Kings and Fours
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 12:41 pm GMT by Ensano
ok... so i've been reading theory of poker and according to them on the Fundamental Theorem of Poker i should be playing the same as if i knew exactly what the villians had...
preflop
AJ vs AA 6:93 or 15.5:1
AJ vs AK, AQ 25:75 or 3:1
AJ vs KK, QQ, JJ 30:70 or 2.33:1
AJ vs 1010 45:55 or 1.22:1
that is of course to see 7 cards but i'd be calling 3.50 to win 13.25.... 3.79:1...
these odds are far better than how big of a dog i am with the exception of AA, not to mention only 1 of the 7 possible hands really has me at a large disadvantage..
if i saw that both players had KK or QQ would a call not be correct?...
also given the possible range villians might be on isn't a call correct allowing for postflop play OTB?
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:48 pm GMT by Jernej Zorec
but u dont know what they have at least not 100%
if u do that ur just results oriented and thats bad
u have to consider future streets also unless betting is capped (nl cap games)
thats why u cant just say u call 3.50 to win 13.25
what about the flop ? if it comes A high like there how much will u be willing to loose if he has AK or AQ
and how much will u win if he has other hands from his range
and when action is like in this hand they will have really strong hands
and more often u will loose a lot more than win
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:08 pm GMT by Ensano
makes perfect sence...
what you're saying is that there are too many postflop variables to be seeing this hand through...
would it be a proper call given villian ranges if calling the 3.5 put me allin?...
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:18 pm GMT by Jernej Zorec
well in that case u are shortstack and i'd say limp push is better action
but yeah once u raise and he reraises u will get chips in most likely
and i'd say his 3 bet range could be wider in that case so might even be correct to call then
Posted Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:14 pm GMT by Phil14312
| Ensano wrote: | makes perfect sence...
what you're saying is that there are too many postflop variables to be seeing this hand through...
would it be a proper call given villian ranges if calling the 3.5 put me allin?... |
You have to remember with that range of hands.
You win the least while ahead, b/c you are always fearing AK or AQ.
And you lose the most while behind, b/c AK or AQ will be putting pressure on you.
Posted Tue Jun 19, 2007 3:28 am GMT by Moon_Child
that was really passive play...
Posted Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:45 am GMT by kingetje
that river is definitely a value bet
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