Posted Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:58 am GMT by StarlightCoast
I've been thinking about this and based on certain factors and painful gameplay experience tell me what you think. I think perhaps it would be best to NEVER raise preflop and here's why. Assuming most people play ring games or tourneys where for a majority of the time you aree at a table with 9 or 10 people If you have AA KK QQ or AK a major raise is going to either chase most if not all away and an all in bet well as we all know with that many people playing AA only wins about 35% of the time. I have lost track of the times I have gone in with these hands and eitherlost, got nothing on the flop, or if in an all-in case get beat by trips or aces if I had KK. I have stopped raising preflop and will call mininum raises only maybe even 2 of them but thats all. As always your comments are welcome.
Did you know that participating in a poker forum can help you improve your own game? Be it by sharing experiences or simply asking for help, participation in a forum helps you focus and keep 'on topic' which will help you improve your game. You can learn from other players feedback and from their experiences. Why the THP poker forums? We offer one of the best managed texas holdem poker forums available, and the community within is far more friendly than those typicaly found on other sites. We've made a 'lurkers edition' of the poker forum available here on Holdem Poker Online, but we encourage all visitors to register and join in on the conversations on TexasHoldem-Poker.com
Posted Fri Jun 18, 2004 8:58 am GMT by MasterShake
The problem with never raising pre-flop is that you're going to have more people beat your good cards with junk because they didn't have to pay much to see the flop.
Posted Fri Jun 18, 2004 10:39 am GMT by kirt
I would agree with MW.
Ya gotta weed out the junk (or at least some) hands otherwise your giving more hands the chance to catch up with you.
K
Posted Fri Jun 18, 2004 5:30 pm GMT by snoogins47
Exactly.
Let's say you're playing NL with $1 and $2 blinds, just for the ease of math.
10 handed game.
You get dealt JJ.
You just call the blind, and get 2 callers, and the SB calls as well.
5 handed game now. $10 pot.
Flop comes with one overcard, and you almost have to fold to any bet. Flop comes straighted or flushed, and you have to be very cautious. This hand is very volatile, and with 4 others in the hand, you've got a very good chance of being beat.
However, let's say you triple the blinds, making it $6 to go. You get one caller.
$15 in the pot, and you're heads up. Heads up against a random, unknown hand, JJ will hold up nearly 80% of the time. That's a little better than having less money in the pot, and having four others that could easily beat you.
Now of course, this is banking on the fact that you do indeed get a caller. However, I think the pros faarrrr out weigh the cons in raising preflop.
Even if it's low limit, where people often say "why raise when everybody stays in anyway?" Raise because your hand is strong.
| Quote: | | ...majority of the time you aree at a table with 9 or 10 people If you have AA KK QQ or AK a major raise is going to either chase most if not all away and an all in bet well as we all know with that many people playing AA only wins about 35% of the time |
Ahem. 9 or 10 people. All putting money in the pot. And you win 35% of the time.
Sounds like a winner to me.
Anyway, it sounds to me like you're almost confused about what you want to happen. You say a major raise is going to chase most people away... but you also point out that strong hands hold up a lower % of the time against many opponents...
In my mind, never raising preflop would have the benefit of disguising your hand... and it would probably contribute to minimizing variance... however, I think your profits would take a hit by doing so as well, very much so.
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:03 am GMT by Ventrick
Anytime I have a made hand, I'm making damn sure that the drawing hands are going to be paying as much as I can make them pay to see that next card.
Posted Mon Jun 21, 2004 9:22 pm GMT by Jauron
If you don't protect your hands your asking to get beat by bad hands.
Thats why you raise preflop. Now it doesn't mean your going to win but if crap hands want to be in pots with me with a big hand, your going to have to pay to see a flop, and then every card after if I catch.
I'll let the math work itself out.
Posted Tue Jun 22, 2004 1:48 am GMT by StarlightCoast
So basically by raising preflop and chasing a certain number of people out you are reducing the number of callers and thus your win percentage on say AA goes up because of the lesser amount of people you have to face. I still can't say I am comfortable raising with JJ or even QQ. There are so many damn loose players that some of these nuts will stay in with any ace or any king even with a raise and since these days I am playing .25/.50 limits the only raise I can put in is a quarter. I guess these preflop raises are only effective in NL so I can try them out my next MTT which I only play NL in those.
Posted Tue Jun 22, 2004 2:17 am GMT by racquet000
With JJ or QQ i raise big to try and collet blinds. ANd if i get a caller. Hope for a low flop and no set for him. Then i push all in depending on the board. If i hit a set and its not threaten ill slowplay it. But If you think theres drawing make them pay
|
|
