Poker Question... Yes this Happened to me |
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Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 3:00 am GMT by BPoacher
I have a question for everyone and was just looking for some input or some official rules if they are known...
I was playing a game of No Limit Texas Holdem with my friends and had went all in on a hand. I was in the lead and as the river card got turned over, everyone thought I had lost because the other person had 3 Queens to my 3 6's... As I had my chips handed over, and antes were placed for the next game, I realized that I really had a full house because there was a pair of queens on the table.
My question to everyone is, when is it too late to fix a problem like this. Everyone had put down their ante, along with the two players playing the big and small blind. The next hand was given out, but no one looked at their cards and no bets were made. That is my story there, please write back and tell me what you all think or might even know from experience in the situation.
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Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 3:54 am GMT by Fat Tony
if the pot has been collected and antes put up for the next hand hand, then i'm afraid i have to say it's a bit too late. tough to call this one without knowing the exact timing of events.
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:10 am GMT by JohnnyCache
One thing you should decide for your games before playing is if "cards speaks" or "Player speaks" - - - in otherwords, if you have to call your hand or if you can toss the cards in the middle after the call and let the room figure out who's high. "Cards speak" is the forgiving way.
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 12:58 pm GMT by Fat Tony
i agree that the cards speak, but it sounds like the pot was already taken down and the next hand was starting. what do you think should have been done at that point????
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 1:34 pm GMT by JohnnyCache
On that pot? It was too late when he noticed. But they should pick one way or the other for the future.
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 1:42 pm GMT by Fat Tony
we're on the same page it appears. :D
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 6:52 pm GMT by BPoacher
Good input, I certainly enjoy listening to opinions. I know its a tough call either way and I suppose the real decision comes down to it being a game played with friends and not in a casino. My offer to them after all of this has been for me to get my money back for our little tourny or a free entry next time, and that is just because we didn't have any preset rules regarding the situation. Does that sound like a fair compromise in the situation?
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 7:47 pm GMT by ballbp
Like Tony said, before the pot is scraped and the next cards are dealt you have an arguement. After that, you don't have a leg to stand on. As you said before, the rules need to be understood beforehand. It's situations like these that really show the need for set guidelines pre-game.
Posted Sun Jun 20, 2004 11:24 pm GMT by pmc
I've had this happen several times. When my friends and I just started playing a few months ago we thought you couldnt use an ace to make an Ace...5 straight. When we found out later I just cancelled what he owed me from that hand. Another time I had full house 3 jacks over 2 nines and he had 3 nines over 2 queens and we thought he'd won for some reason. In this case he just cancelled what I owed him from that game. I guess it depends on what your friends are willing to accept.
Posted Mon Jun 21, 2004 7:48 am GMT by JohnnyCache
| BPoacher wrote: | | Good input, I certainly enjoy listening to opinions. I know its a tough call either way and I suppose the real decision comes down to it being a game played with friends and not in a casino. My offer to them after all of this has been for me to get my money back for our little tourny or a free entry next time, and that is just because we didn't have any preset rules regarding the situation. Does that sound like a fair compromise in the situation? |
What everybody is kind of tip-toeing around here is that you layed down a full house without knowing you had it . . . it sucks, but you should probably just take this like a beat. . .
Posted Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:38 am GMT by nicthestick
as soon as the cards hit the muck, your options are through. With friends, I might be a little more forgiving, but in a casino, if your cards hit the Muck, its all over.
Posted Tue Jun 29, 2004 6:33 am GMT by JimTheBullet
I think the cut off is the point where (a) the chips are raked into the winner's stack or (b) the point at which the cards are collected together, whichever happens first as in the first case you cannot guarantee that you would be raking back the correct amount and in the second case you no longer have the evidence of who should have won the hand.
I had something similar when I was playing in a casino game when I was very green. I was dealing (self dealing tourney) and I got A4, can't remember what action happened before the flop, long time ago, but I hit two more aces on the flop so obviously I like my hand. We were still in the rebuy period and it was pot limit so I raised the max when it was my turn and basically three of us ended up playing the pot all in and we flipped our cards. One of the guys said "I need a four for the straight" as he turned his cards, can't even remember the other guys hand so it must have been crap. Anyway, I was so absorbed in the thought that my 3 aces could be outdrawn by his straight (why are you calling for an inside straight with the board paired anyway???) that I completely failed to notice that he was drawing dead since a 4 would fill my boat.
Anyway the 4 came on the river and he pulled the pot towards himself. Now, I was dealer and the guy to my left says "how come he beat your full house?" Fortunately, I was so gutted that I had not cleared the cards properly and I still had the A4 exposed in front of me. At this point I pointed to them and the guy who had taken the pot originally says something like "Yeah, you're right, full house, fair enough" and pushes all the chips over to me (somebody else had gathered the community already).
I feel I was fortunate in that hand in a lot of respects, not least that everybody had a clear memory of him saying "I need a four for a straight" so that it was obvious that I had made a boat because I still had the A4. Also, as he was all in (I slightly outchipped him) there was no need to dispute the size of the pot, it had to be all the chips he now had. Lastly, I think that guy could easily have told me to shove it as I should have spotted my boat and according to my own criteria for "too late" it was too late to correct it.
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