Posted Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:23 pm GMT by pathomps
How many hands do you fold per hour or a better question might be, what percentage of hands would you play per hour at a limit game, on average?
I'm trying to sharpen up my limit game, playing mostly top 10 hands, maybe go just outside that when I get really bored. Anyways, I'm folding a lot and just wanting to compare notes.
Thanks in advance.
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Posted Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:43 pm GMT by Dave B
I like to see 25-30% of flops.
Posted Mon Jul 12, 2004 4:37 pm GMT by snoogins47
I've heard people theorize that playing only the top 10 hands, and playing them very well, would be a break-even or slight money-losing proposition in most games.
Basically, only playing the top 10 hands isn't a bad idea, in early position.
In late position, I often find myself limping with tons of hands, especially to big pots. Mediocre hands like KTs that depending on the game I might muck up front, can often become raising propositions in LP.
Most of the hard data I've seen on stronger, winning limit players puts them probably around 20% of flops seen, some lower, some higher (I think as you get better at the game, and especially if you're playing against mediocre players, loosening up isn't a bad idea, as if you can make much better decisions post-flop than they do, mediocre hands can probably eke out a +EV. ) This also depends, because a higher figure may be including hands from the blinds.
I would say that only the top 10 would be way too low...
Up front, especially under the gun, I tend to restrict myself to AK, AQs, the big pairs (Down to TT, usually), and that's about it. Maybe KQs, etc... Basically, I want something that 1)I can bring in for a raise, and 2)can stand a raise if it gets sent around again to me.
In middle position, I start to loosen up a bit, depending on the early action...
I wish I could give you something set in stone, but I really can't. Here's just a few keys to remember.
Play tight in front, loosen up in back.
Let the # of people in the hand and the pot size be your guide. Late position, there's a raise... but 6 callers ahead of you, and you're on the BB with A2s.... get your ass in that pot!
and always... STAY AGGRESSIVE!
Other than that... just keep plugging away, and pick the brains of everybody here, we've got some solid players.
Posted Mon Jul 12, 2004 5:25 pm GMT by pathomps
Thanks, that is very good advice.
Posted Tue Jul 13, 2004 11:59 am GMT by pathomps
If you have 2 overcards after the flop and are in late position with one bet and 1-3 callers before you, do you call or fold?
Posted Tue Jul 13, 2004 4:14 pm GMT by snoogins47
if it's a huge pot and I have some sort of other draw (inside straight even, maybe with a backdoor flush) I might stick around.
Pure overcards... you've got 6 outs to make a hand that might be second best. With that many callers, depending on the flop, you might get owned if you pair up.
Theoretical situation.
On the button with AKo. 4 callers in front, you raise, blinds dump, all 4 call.
10 small bets in the pot.
Flop comes T 9 7, rainbow.
UTG bets, and everybody calls to you.
14 small bets in the pot, you're about 7 to 1 to pair up an overcard... proper odds, no?
But lets look here, at what the other four are holding.
We have:
1: AT
2: K9
3: A8
4: 56
Oh look, now you're drawing almost completely dead;P
Now, if you had AKc, board is say, Jc Ts 4h
Your pair outs still might be clean, but it's not very certain. However, you've got the off chance at the backdoor flush (with sky high implied odds, most likely,) 4 outs to broadway... 6 to your TP/TK... while this isn't an amazing situation to be in either, I think it's closer to justified to make this call.
So short answer: It VERY MUCH depends on specific situations. Just remember: Pure overcards aren't much of a draw, you're about 7:1 to make a pair on either next card to come (per card I mean, 7:1 to make on the turn, 7:1 to make on the river) giving you slightly under 25% to having paired up one of your cards by the river. If your overs aren't AK, then there's an even smaller chance you'll hold up, because of the additional factor that your pair might not end up being top pair.
So in many circumstances like you outlined I would probably fold. In a 5 way pot, I'm really not typically feeling too amazing about top pair, even if I do make it, it's not usually a hand that can take alot of heat.
Posted Tue Jul 13, 2004 5:12 pm GMT by pathomps
Thanks.........
With everything being said in this thread, I'm assuming you loosen up you game marginally when your playing short handed. As you go down in players, the more hands you can play?
Posted Tue Jul 13, 2004 10:58 pm GMT by NewHoldemPlayer
It depends on how many people are in the game
If its a full table, it should definatle be around 25 or 30%.
In the shorthanded tables, I tend to go to 50 or 60%
Posted Tue Jul 13, 2004 11:08 pm GMT by Ninja
Like Dave said, 25-30%. about 15% early-middle position, then I open up and play suited connectors, any cards that add up to twenty, any pocket pairs, etc. etc.
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