Posted Tue Sep 21, 2004 12:05 pm GMT by K-rug
For those of you that know or don't I recently came back from a five day trip to Reno. In that time I learned a lot about casino play or more accurately today's players in casinos. I am not by any means a professional poker player and I don't do this to supplement my income. I am however a student of the game and spend on average easily 20-30 hours a week playing Texas Hold'em (limit and no). I have been doing this for years and have a weekly game and organized quarterly tournament. I even developed a website to track our weekly winnings, loses, averages, etc. This is my story of the last five days.
The Casino Players:
My god... They are horrible. They fish. They call. They re-raise with a pair of fives. They fold with AK. They are horribly bad. Badly horrible. I have played with enough of the regulars here to know that if you went to a Casino you will do much much better than the majority at the table. They go all-in all the time with 78s. They re-raise with J9s because... it's suited. Oy! Learn how to play against them and to play them and you will be successful. Everyone thinks they are a rounder.
The first day while me and my friends tried to grasp how lose and reckless these casino players are one of my friends said, "Now I know how the pros felt at the WSOP this year." With regards to people calling bad hands to 5th and hitting it what they need. This isn't to say that we think we are professionals. But based on what I saw, the majority of you reading this and majority of the people I play with on a regular basis are a thousand times better than the majority of those sitting in the casino card rooms.
Day 1: The Peppermill fiasco
My journey started last Thursday at the Peppermill casino in Reno at the $100 + $15 NL Texas Hold'em Tournament. This was by far the worst casino tournament I have ever experienced. First, the dealers didn't know what the blind structure was or the amounts. Second, they didn't know it after we started playing and continually made wrong calls, allowing string bets and even trying to rake the pot. The tournament director said the event was to be capped at 30 players (three tables). Although, at my table we played eleven handed starting the tournament with 31 players in all. However, they continued to allow alternates to join the tournament all the way up to the third level of play.
The dealers would routinely skip over players assuming they checked even if no motion or verbal statement was made royally screwing several players out of action. This skipping over of players happened at some point in one out of every three hands. But the biggest debacle was the players vs. dealer vs. tournament director argument. The person in the SB had 1400 in chips. The SB was 1000 at that point. The BB raised all-in. A person in late position called and the SB went all-in for 400. Naturally the SB can only win 1400 x 3. The dealer tried to say he could only win 400 x 3 as the 1000 was committed as the blind!? WTF!? The tournament director stepped up and got the whole thing assed up even more. It took one of the players to explain to the dealer and T.D. what betting took place. Eventually after about 5 minutes of arguing they got it straight. This should never happen.
For your buy-in you received 800 in chips. However, you were allowed one re-buy which gave you almost double, 1200 to be exact, the amount of chips you bought in for. So what this caused players to do was go all-in early on horrible plays and re-buy if they lost. Typically, the exact opposite one should use in a tournament. In the first 20 minutes before the blinds even went up one level 13 of the 31 starting players went all-in and lost. Then they used their single re-buy and now had almost twice as many chips as they had a few minutes ago!! Crazy!! Almost half the field got eliminated before the first level of play was raised!! I cannot find the words to describe my disgust. When I was busted out and someone asked me if I was going to use my re-buy, I answered, no. You would have thought that I said I was going to kill their mothers. They couldn't comprehend why someone wouldn't re-buy.
With the exception of maybe six guys, no one had a clue how to play. It was a tournament filled with guys thinking they were WSOP final table material. I saw an all-in A2o get called by an A3o. I saw an A6o go all-in only to get re-raised all-in and have a third person re-raise the re-raiser all-in with J8o. The second guy who re-raised folded so it was A6o vs J8o. I saw 69s all-in get called by a J5s. This was par play for the course. A few of you will try to make the argument that hey, maybe they were trying to bluff and buy the pot. No... I am sorry. You were not there. This is how these guys played pretty much 100% of the time.
My brother actually made it to the final table and was the only person at the table who DID NOT re-buy. At the start of the final table the tournament director announced that the top five players would get paid out. My brother earlier made a move and busted this guy out who obviously was a sore loser and hung around after to see who won and bitched about his loss for a while (this will come into play later). Then my brother went all-in on AA to have it get beat by 65o only for the guy to catch a straight. He went out in 7th place. But wait... There's more... Then the tournament director announced that the top six places were going to get paid out. My brother missed the money by one place. This sucks because had he won he not the other guy would get paid for 6th place. What sort of horseshit is this, he asked?!
In the end, an alternate who entered at level 3 play and immediately re-bought and a kid who worked at the concierge desk for the Peppermill and who was getting lucky as heck split the 1st and 2nd place prize money. Myself, I actually went head to head against a guy pre-flop early. I had AKo he had 9Ts. He called my all-in and caught a flush on me on the river. Lucky bastard.
Day 2-5 Circus Circus:
No Limit
We stuck to our home base casino Circus Circus for the remainder of our stay. We had rooms there and it was actually getting quite cold during the night. In fact it snowed one night so we thought why go out? We practically lived in the poker room. I cannot emphasize enough how poorly the majority of casino players play. Which made me and my three friends feel like vultures preying on the weak. The Circus Circus card room is extremely well run. There is also no smoking which I especially love. At night the female card room manager Red is very cool and most of the dealers are funny and very nice. I say most because the one guy my brother busted out at the Peppermill who hung around and was being a sore loser as it turned out is a dealer at Circus Circus, Jerry. While Jerry was a nice guy to me and the rest of the table, he couldn't have been a bigger prick to my brother. My brother being the bigger man and quite possible the drunkest person in the room just let it roll off his back. On a side note, I played against him on the No Limit table at the Circus Circus and he is a horrible player. But even more so, I think because he is a dealer he has this Napoleonic syndrome of he is better than you for the fact that he is a dealer. He is also kind of short too so maybe that factors into it.
The No Limit play at the Circus Circus card room starts at 7 p.m. There is also a $15 "World's Biggest but Smallest No Limit Texas Hold'em Tournament" or something like that. Basically, it is a No Limit Hold'em Tournament that starts at 4 p.m. daily and ends at 5 p.m. Yes that is right, a one hour No Limit Tournament. What's the point of having a tournament if it only lasts an hour? I don't know. But it only costs $15 to play and you get 1000 chips with 1st place getting $270. Get down their early if you want to play. Better yet, get down there at 2:00 p.m. and sit at any Hold'em table so you will get preference to sign-up for the tournament. There are also no re-buys. Sadly, I was knocked out of that one too. Early position went all-in for 275. I re-raised all-in 750 with AA. Late position says, "Well, I am either going to win the tournament right here or lose it all." He called my all-in with AQs. He actually caught a straight on 5th. Yes a straight...
The No Limit players are so ungodly horrible they are good. You will have on average 4-5 callers to the flop playing some sort of straight draw or flush draw, even if it is 65s or A8o. Usually someone will fish to 5th and hit it. If you are feeling adventurous hit up the Circus Circus NL table at 7 p.m. It is one helluva ride! If you are any good and most of you reading this are good enough, you will prosper there.
Limit
Most people at Circus Circus play the $2/$4 and $3/$6 tables. I say most because that is generally the only kind of Texas Hold'em tables they run until 7 p.m. rolls around and they open up a single No Limit table. I split time between the $2/$4 and $3/$6 tables for the majority of the time. The $3/$6 table is a kill table as well. If there is $60 in the pot the next hand becomes $4/$8 instead of $3/$6 and oh my do Kill pots breed Kill pots.
Again, the players at these tables for the most part are absolutely horrible. At the $2/$4 table you will have 6 yes 6 callers pre-flop. Don't even think of trying to buy a pot on either of these tables. Generally there will be three players at showdown if not more. If you re-raise you will get all or 3/4ths of the people to call no matter if you are at pre-flop, flop, turn or at the river. My advice to anyone who wants to play at a casino table like this, play the players. I cannot stress this enough. Look for tells. They are abundant. I once played at a table with one Asian woman who tried to either bluff on 4th or would re-raise on 5th all the time. When she bluffed she put her hand on her mouth. I called her out so many times on it she finally got up and left. Two of the players at your table will go to 5th street and fold almost all of the time. Don't let people calling or re-raising rattle you early on. But also pay attention to the board. If there is a chance for someone having a gut shot straight, they probably do. Know when to fold your cards and learn what to play. Again, play the players.
This one lady sat down who had no clue how to play. The guy next to me said, "I'll split her chips with you." I said, "deal". Sadly, he took about 2/3 of her chips and I was only able to take 1/3. But we polished her off in about 45 minutes. All $100 worth. It was a thing of beauty.
So if you are going to Reno any time soon, here is my advice:
*Don't play at the Peppermill's $100 + $15 NL Tournament
*Unless you are feeling adventurous play the NL table at Circus Circus
*Do play the $2/$4 or $3/$6 table at Circus Circus
*Do make friends with Red the night manager and the dealers
*Don't forget to tip the dealers when you hit a bonus hand. I hit 4 K's and forgot to tip one. I made sure next time they sat down to tip him though.
*Play the players
*Don't let the number of callers rattle you. There will be 200% more than there should
*No one will give you credit for your hand, bet or read
We went in and out of a few casinos but really liked Circus Circus the best. I can't stress how fun, clean and nice their card room is. I would definitely hit them up if I were you. The El Dorado was ok. Nothing special. Same type of players. But the Circus Circus poker room was just more fun and clean.
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Posted Tue Sep 21, 2004 12:20 pm GMT by Nut Flush
Nice lunch break read! Sounds like you had a great trip.
Posted Tue Sep 21, 2004 12:44 pm GMT by K-rug
Thanks I did. Hopefully the title "An Essay" will queue people in that it will be a long read. I am still in shock at the amount of garbage people play hand after hand after hand.
Oh and P.S. This was a great hand.
I get dealt KK. I raise pre-flop and everyone calls. Flop comes, KKx. Someone bets, someone raises, I call for "Time". I look at the monitor that shows what the bonus amounts are and wait for the KKKK to appear. I see and ask the dealer for a count of the money in the pot. I has to be more than $20 for a bonus to pay out. If it is not, Circus Circus allows you to talk about your hand to induce betting. Such as, "I have KKKK if you bet $3 to make my bonus I'll give you $10". The dealer says it's over $20, I re-raise. Asian lady (see above) bets, guy calls, I re-raise, they all call. River comes, same thing only this time they fold. I show KKKK and won $66 bonus and about $55 from the action.
My friend hit two straight flushes within 45 minutes to pay out almost $500 in bonus money. He got them against the same guy each time and each time the guy had an A high flush. Ouch...
Posted Sun Oct 03, 2004 11:36 am GMT by mindgame
Excellent work. I'm going to Reno in two weeks and you've saved me a lot of legwork. One question, though.
Where are the middle limit tables???? I want 6/12, 10/20 or 12/24. Any of that out there????
Posted Mon Oct 04, 2004 12:00 am GMT by K-rug
Honestly, I didn't see any. We went to four casinos, Circus Circus, El Dorado, Peppermill and Silver Legacy. Unless maybe they opened at a certain time such as the case of the No Limit table I did not notice any mid-level tables. I guess my suggestion would be the 3/6 kill at Circus Circus. After trying them all we liked that room the best so it is intirely possible that I missed them because they opened at a certain time that we were not there for.
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