Posted Wed Nov 03, 2004 9:15 am GMT by Gogie
In online poker, does the poker software determine the cards to be dealt prior to the first card being dealt? In other words, are the cards predetermined, such that the cards you see on the flop, turn and river would be the same whether you played or not?
This may seem trivial, but it does matter to me. How many times have you folded, only to see your miracle cards fall and you miss out on a monster pot? Would the same cards have fallen if you hadn't folded?
I know that for Vegas slot machines, each spin's results are independently determined. The fact that I may sit down at a machine and hit a jackpot on my first spin doesn't mean that the person sitting down before me would have hit the jackpot with one more spin had they stayed. Slot machine spin results are determined only when you actually hit the button (or pull the lever). The exact moment you hit the button "stops" the RNG and determines what your spin will be. Is this the way online poker works (taking into account, obviously, cards already dealt)? I.e., when you click your mouse, does that stop the RNG, which then determines the next card to be dealt, or will the next card dealt be the same regardless of who does what and when?
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Posted Wed Nov 03, 2004 9:20 am GMT by Nut Flush
Does the deck change in real life if you fold? I would guess that poker sites randomize the 52 cards(also called shuffling) and then are dealt out from the top.
I've also folded many times at home and in card rooms just to see that my rags would have turned into gold. I'll still fold those crap hands the next time too.
Posted Wed Nov 03, 2004 12:26 pm GMT by Gogie
So let me ask the question once more:
Does anyone KNOW if the order of the cards dealt is set once the cards begin to be dealt, or is there a random number generator that is continually coming into play as each set of cards (i.e., hole cards, flop, turn and river) are dealt?
I'm well aware that a physical deck of cards is not continually reshuffled before cards are dealt, but that doesn't mean that poker software isn't set up that way. I'm not a programmer so I don't know if it's easier or "better" to do it one way or another. Anyone out there actually KNOW the answer?
Posted Thu Nov 04, 2004 1:26 am GMT by alan
...but I do know that slots are programmed to give you Near Misses. Can't see why video poker wouldn't do the same thing. I don't play video poker partly because I can't help but feel it's just slots with cards.
But, again, I also don't know...
Posted Thu Nov 04, 2004 1:46 am GMT by Sean_in_NJ
| Gogie wrote: | | Anyone out there actually KNOW the answer? |
I can tell you that doing it in either fashion isn't technically difficult, although the continuous shuffling would require a little bit more code.
Now I don't KNOW how it's specifically done (although I'd be willing to bet there's no continuous shuffling), but it really wouldn't matter either way unless you're one of those paranoid folks that insists online poker is cold-decked and rigged for action.
Why not do a little research on your own and check with the company that certifies the RNG? Those specs should be readily available to the public for the asking.
Posted Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:24 am GMT by ilikepoker
the only site i know about is full tilt. others might be different. i know about full tilt because i saw one of the pros talking about it (cant remember which pro). the cards that are dealt there are determined after the betting action. but i wouldnt go and assume that they're out to get you for folding. who knows they might be. but the paranoia will destroy you before their scheme (if any) will.
Posted Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:47 am GMT by JoePits
I tend to play better at sites that do not predetermine the 5 board cards. I think its because thats how it works in real life. A site I avoid because of this is PokerStars, they determine all 5 cards before the flop.
Posted Fri Jan 28, 2005 1:02 pm GMT by JohnnyCache
A card is equally likely to fall if they shuffle before or after each card.
Posted Mon Feb 07, 2005 4:45 pm GMT by NickFlynn
I think the idea behind continuously shuffling the remaining cards is to enhance security. I assume all reputable poker sites only send the card data out when the cards are displayed for obvious reasons. If the deck is only shuffled before the hand, the server is potentially vulnerable to exploits that could (theoretically) make the game vulnerable to cheaters. it would probably be pretty difficult to execute this type of hack, but then again, you wouldn't think someone would be able to figure out ways to beat electronic slots, and that has happened.
Constantly shuffling the remaining cards in the deck during the hand pretty much makes this type of exploit hopeless.
- Nick
Posted Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:56 pm GMT by JohnnyCache
constantly shuffling is a good idea. It's not like it's processor intensive.
Posted Sun Feb 20, 2005 7:43 am GMT by TexacoStovner
I asked expekt.com (poker-site) for this and here is the answer:
Q:
Hi.
Is a card-deck in poker pre-delt. Or is each communety-card it a random draw wich is influenced somehow
by actions at the table. Or simpler, is the communety-card delt on table after I folded the same as I had recieved
if I was still in the game. Maybe a strange question but I hope for an answer anyway.
Answer:
The cards are dealt completely randomly, just before they are displayed at the table.
They wouldnt say anymore (afraid that I was trying to exploit info)
but I take it that the cards are not the same, folded or not.
Posted Sun Feb 20, 2005 9:16 am GMT by wEbMaStEr
On most every site i know......
The cards are continuously shuffled until each card is dealt as opposed to the cards are shuffled until the start of the hand and then dealt as they are.
I believe the reason for this is to prevent any possibility of people having advance knowledge of what the next card is.
Obviously the mucked cards do not go back into the pack as they are being shuffled so there is no chance that cards you have mucked will come out on the board.
As someone rightly says, the fact that the cards are still being shuffled up to the point that a card is needed has no effect on the chances of any particular card falling or not falling.
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