Random stupidity or card marking? |
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Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:14 am GMT by Iron Butt
I recently started playing at a local home game. Last time I went, I brought a set of Kems. Cleaning them up later, I noticed something strange. Several of the cards, including 2 of the aces, had dents in them. Two small indentations, the first about 3/4 an inch from the top and 1/4 inch from the side, maybe 1/2 inch apart, parallel to the long side. Like if you put the card on a padded surface, put two fingers on them, and pressed down hard. The damage is about the same place and degree on each card.
Now these guys aren't real slick card handlers or real good players (played there 4 times and cashed every time) so it's hard to figure them for cheaters or at least they're not good cheaters LOL. But I'm a little concerned... someone who will try to cheat you will try something else I figure if the cheating doesn't work. And I don't see how you'd do that without trying, and why two aces out of maybe 5 affected cards?
So my question is does anyone think this is cheating? Has anyone heard of this as a method of cheating? I can see where it could be cheating... for instance once you had all the aces done, they'd cause a slight gap in the deck where they were, you could probably cut to an ace every time with a little practice, etc.
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Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:42 am GMT by Logik
Yeah its marking cards. If there's an ace on the board and he doesn't have one he can look for the indentations on your cards to see if you have the ace.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:18 am GMT by Flitred
If you didn't lose too much..i'd be pretty bitter about the fact that my KEM cards are damaged! Next time go to Costco, spend $13 for 12 or so decks, and change them out every 3-4 hands or so....constantly rotate them....and of course keep an eye out for anybody bending them.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:25 am GMT by The Nutz
hmmm... that's a little concerning to me. Only because I just realized I never think of that.  I'm pretty sure that wouldn't happen at my house, but I'm not sure it doesn't happen when I go elsewhere. I'm glad I saw this.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 10:32 am GMT by Double Eagle
Same thing happened at my house last weekend. After about three hands, someone noticed a card had been "fingernailed." I hope to be able to get a replacement from Copag but I haven't tried yet.
Has anyone had any success getting replacements from Copag?
Eric
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:21 am GMT by PanthersHUTCH15
Yes. A little ways down the first page I have a topic started title "Creased Copags", which I think everyone should read. I had a card get creased after about 2 weeks of using them, I almost didn't do anything about it, but decided to go ahead and e-mail them.
They said give us your address and phone-number and we will get a replacement out to you. About 5 business days later, a brand new double deck of the same kind of Copags showed up at my door with a not to just send in the damaged card and the warranty card. So...for 15 bucks, I got 3 decks of Copags and 1 deck of 51 as well.....good for if another one gets damages because I have replacements for all but one.
With the way KEMs have been being made lately and poorly manufactured decks being sent out...including a couple to me...This temporarily puts me in favor of Copags, but nothing beats my good set of KEM Arrows.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:44 am GMT by MeridianFC
I believe that move is called crimping and it is a very basic and old school cheating method. It could just be mishandeling, but it does seem susupicious. If you put a new deck in play and notice it again, you've got some mechanics.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 1:12 pm GMT by grandgnu
Uh....I don't think he has "card mechanics" if it happens again. He has cheaters, but not necessarily "mechanics". A mechanic would manipulate the deck, set it up in a way to give themselves the better hand.
This is likely a player who is trying to know what cards others are holding. But like they said, it may be possible with the indentations for him/her to feel the cards out of the deck while shuffling, so there is a possiblity of a mechanic, but more possibility that they're marking to gain info.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 2:07 pm GMT by Iron Butt
Thanks for the replies, interesting that everyone thinks it's cheating. I had kinda convinced myself it wasn't... maybe because I'd hate to give up that game, I'm up $200 or so there LOL.
After inspecting the cards again I now realize it's a lot less random than I thought at first. It's on the black aces and almost all the rest of the clubs. I guess that kinda ties it up, that has to be intentional.
Can anyone fill me in on how this is used? I don't think this could be seen across the table for instance, I barely noticed it while closely inspecting the cards. Why would you mark one suit?
I think I'm going to play there at least once more, but yeah they can ruin their own damn cards and I'll be keeping an eye out. Should be fun... everyone liked the cards so it'll be fun to explain that I didn't bring them this week because some of them had this weird thing on them LOL... see if anyone squirms.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 2:27 pm GMT by PanthersHUTCH15
Any plastic cards that I had that were unintentionally damaged were somewhat hard to see up close, but if you caught it in the light at the right angle it was very apparent. Like someone mentioned earlier, maybe they aren't looking for it, rather feeling for it when they deal. Sounds to me like cheating obviously, but I would assume they are trying to be able to look across and see the cards.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 3:40 pm GMT by Flitred
so when you play, just be sure and put your low cards on top of your aces 
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:57 pm GMT by Imajica1975
I hate people who cheat.
The world is full of them too...
I never undertood what the fun in winning could be if you didn't earn it. I mean sure you get the money assuming you don't get caught. But if you've ever felt the feeling of winning something that you worked for, then any other kind of winning just pales in comparison.
Oh well... such is life, I guess.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:23 pm GMT by PocketRocket
Would it be too presumptious to guess that the culprits are relatively young, have recently learned to play poker as part of the fad, and have been reading/skimming a lot of gaming material? It's a pretty basic marking method even for an amateur.
Posted Thu Feb 03, 2005 7:08 pm GMT by Prettey Toney
I wouldn't even bother trying to figure it out.
Just find another game, its that simple.
There are plenty of good honest games out there, find one.
As innocent and ignorant as it may seem, it's dangerous.
You are right about trying something else if cheating doesn't work. These are the same sorts who would probably mug you as you walk out with alot of their cash. (maybe I'm overexaggerating and wrong, but why risk it, you play with fire, you get burned)  .
Posted Fri Feb 04, 2005 5:40 am GMT by duma
i see this all the time at the casino i go to. they use A+ playing cards. POS's if u ask me. one time i noticed a crimp on one fo the Kings on the board. a couple of hands later i got dealt K 9. board comes 9c Kc x. i bet and get 3 callers. when the dealer burns the next card, i notice the same exact King that was crimped! turn is another club so i checked and this one guy bet out and i folded. he ended up getting a caller on his flush. but i was proud of myself to notice that King and not bet with my 2 pair. u gotta pay attention to everything going on at the table, and then use it to your advantage. i duno if someone was trying to cheat or maybe it was because the A+ are pieces of crap, but you gotta watch your back on things like this.
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